Shocking experience during rough inspection

[ivsenroute]

This past Friday morning, my first inspection was a rough wire for a SFR that had been completely gutted by the young homeowner. He wants to be a contractor and his dad (who has no experience) is helping him completely remodel the house. I had done a service inspection a few months ago and returned on Friday for the electrical rough and plumbing rough.

Not a bad job, they already heard about me so they got some help and were pretty much ready to go. I was checking to see if the grounds were connected inside the plastic boxes. All of the wires were bent back into the boxes and uncapped as I normally see them on rough. I had a hard time seeing inside the bathroom receptacle/switch box so I moved the wires out of the way. When I pulled them out of the box BAM. A large spark and the next thing I know I have a burn mark on my finger and the hot and ground are fused together.

That was the beginning of the end of the inspection. I can't believe I did not check these wires. They were surprised too and ran down to the main panel to shut off the rest of the breakers. I had to ask them why the hell they had power applied for a rough inspection when none of the wires were capped and no devices were installed.

I was getting lax and compromised safety. I hope we all pay more attention than I did.

 

[nakulak]

A little juice a day will keep the doctor away (but not necessarily the mortician). Look to the positive - it saved you from having to get another cup of coffee.

 

[hardworkingstiff]

I'm glad your OK (I'm assuming so since you posted).

Thanks for the reminder about getting complacent.

 

[augie47]

Our system allows for "early on power" prior to completion. I am always amazed that "electricians" don't understand why I don't release for power when all the homeruns are made-up at the panel and are all "open ended" throughout the house.

 

[SEO]

I had sparks fly out of a box on rough inspection before and always check now. Many homeowners who do their own wiring will energize the circuits to check out if they will work. On a countless number of occasions with homewoners they will have temp lights installed and switches and devices connected and powered up for a rough inspection.

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

I have trained a few inspectors. One of the items I train, is not to touch any of the contractor's work. If something needs to be moved or opened or tested, their personnel needs to be present. If no one is present for a particular inspection, and an inspector cannot discern what is installed, another inspection is scheduled and the contractor will have someone present. This kind of verbage is explained to them, which usually means the contractor will have someone there...although in my experience not all the time.

I know a lot of inspectors poke around installations (even a couple I have trained). My camera was very good at documenting stuff I either did not understand or could not see.

Not breaking chops, but if an inspector is moving stuff around, in my opinion he becomes responsible if something goes wrong, since he was in the box or whatever last.

 

[iwire]

If something needs to be moved or opened or tested, their personnel needs to be present.

Do I have to carry them around the job or are they allowed to walk on their own? :grin:

I always try to be on hand for inspections and be helpful but I don't think it's to much to expect an inspector to move wires in a box so they can see a ground screw or something.

I had one inspector scream at me over the phone "Who's going to push the button?" I had asked him to inspect some emergency lights and mentioned no one from our company would be there. Give me a break. :roll:

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

Do I have to carry them around the job or are they allowed to walk on their own? :grin:

I always try to be on hand for inspections and be helpful but I don't think it's to much to expect an inspector to move wires in a box so they can see a ground screw or something.

I had one inspector scream at me over the phone "Who's going to push the button?" I had asked him to inspect some emergency lights and mentioned no one from our company would be there. Give me a break. :roll:

Unfortunately there are too many idiots out there...whether inspectors or contractors. It is a part of life I highly doubt will ever go away and a reality we need to learn how to deal with...I did not say settle with.


If I came across as meaning a contractor or his man needs to be there every time, that is not what I meant.
I can say that for ANY inspection that may be different of difficult, the contractor (and the inspector) will only benefit by having a representative there.

The building departments around my area will not go to any job without someone from the construction company present...I wonder why that is so?



But, I feel very strongly about an inspector ever touching any of the installation, ever. I know I do not, even though there are times I would love to - "curiousity killed the cat" kind of feeling.





P.S. IF you are going to carry me around, you may need a ric-shaw.

 

[brother]

Thanks for the reminder on safety. Even though I agree with Pierre about inspectors touching stuff, I do understand at times you just trying to make things quick and easy.

That being said, I strongly suggest you start useing a voltage detector wand especially if its homeowners that do their own work. I hate to say it, but I had met an inspector that had a wand that had NEVER used it, and I had to show them how to use it. They had been in inpecting for years.

Here is a link about a double male end cord that was hot but a friend that was using a volt tick was able to spot it and keep from being shocked.

http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=119144

Safety is everyones responsibility, I know that a propertly working 'volt tick' would have prevented this from happening.
Be safe

 

[cowboyjwc]

I'm with Gus on this one. If I knew that they were gutting the house the panel would not have gotten power until final inspection.

 

[RICK NAPIER]

When I do inspections I use my plastic pen to move wires in a box. Its not fool proof but it helps.

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

I'm with Gus on this one. If I knew that they were gutting the house the panel would not have gotten power until final inspection.

I believe that is a jurisdictional issue.
Where we work, the service can be energized as soon as it is completed, even before the roughing starts. Many contractors will try to do this to eliminate the need for temp power.

 

[cowboyjwc]

It is, and they try it here too, but we're trying to keep everyone safe.

 

[iwire]

It is, and they try it here too, but we're trying to keep everyone safe.

:roll:

Protecting all if they need it or not.:roll:

We would get a service inspection and engergize that, I don't think there is anything in the NEC to prohibit that regardless of what may or may not be done.

 

[tom baker]

Not a bad job, they already heard about me so they got some help and were pretty much ready to go. .

First of all, thanks for reminding us to always check for power on.
And by the above, I think what you mean is you enforce the code.
Thanks for that as well.

 

[cowboyjwc]

:roll:

Protecting all if they need it or not.:roll:

We would get a service inspection and engergize that, I don't think there is anything in the NEC to prohibit that regardless of what may or may not be done.

What do you need the power for? Nothings hooked up. Hook it all up and then call me.

Just trying to keep Mr. Smith from being the late Mr. Smith.

I bet that most of us here have a story of how we got shocked and most of them will contain the comment, or one like it, "I didn't know it was hot."

 

[LarryFine]

Around here, we can request a service inspection, which requires a complete electrode system, panel EGCs and groundeds made up, and a single-receptacle outlet (such as laundry) with GFCI protection.

While I'm not sure if it's required, I also make up all my device and equipment boxes, the EGCs and groundeds. Plus, I like to prepare the ungrounded wires and pigtails for trim-out at this time.

 

[sandsnow]

I had one inspector scream at me over the phone "Who's going to push the button?"

ROFLMAO

Reinforcing the old stereotype

 

[mcclary's electrical]

Around here, we can request a service inspection, which requires a complete electrode system, panel EGCs and groundeds made up, and a single-receptacle outlet (such as laundry) with GFCI protection.

While I'm not sure if it's required, I also make up all my device and equipment boxes, the EGCs and groundeds. Plus, I like to prepare the ungrounded wires and pigtails for trim-out at this time.

I don't strip the ungrounded, because they will get painted. Also, sometimes the money runs out and you might not trim it out for a few years, or never. So I always do bare minimum on rough in. I wasted time and money before doing too much.

 

[K8MHZ]

Here we get power on the service inspection.

My practice has been to shut down all circuits and the main for rough in unless the need exists for a receptacle. In that case it would be a single receptacle circuit, the rest would be off.

Until I meet an inspector I don't like, the above will be the case. :roll: