Smallest possible EV Level 2 circuit?

Status
Not open for further replies.
G

gene6

Senior Member
Location
NY
Occupation
Electrician
Question for the group, long story short a relative of mine as part of a legal settlement is required to provide "Incoming service capacity for a minimum level 2 electric vehicle charger" to his rental.
What is the minimum VA for a level 2 car charger can be before its a level 1??
Are there any hard wired level 2 chargers that can be installed on a 2 pole 20 or even 2 pole 15?
Thanks
 
The distinction between Level 1 vs Level 2 is not a matter of differences in current levels.

Level 1 means the EVSE is passing 120VAC to the car.

Level 2 means the EVSE is passing 208/240 to the car.

There are many (non adjustable) 16A L2 EVSEs out there, which could be run on a 2 pole 20A breaker. Many will come with a plug, but I'm sure hardwired versions are available, or the cord can be removed by you and the unit hardwired. Or just install a NEMA 6-20 receptacle and plug it in.

Just be aware a lot of really inexpensive EVSEs, on places like Amazon, are made in China and you tend to get what you pay for.

btw... the SAE J1772 standard sets the lowest current limit at 6A. My adjustable Chargepoint (L2) unit at my house can be set as low as 8A on the app.

Hope this helps.
 
Last edited:
MD Automation said:
...
Or just install a NEMA 6-20 receptacle and plug it in. ...
Click to expand...

While I agree that this would strictly speaking meet the quoted language of the settlement, to the lay person this receptacle is easily confused with a 120V outlet. To avoid potentially dealing with the lawyers *again*, I would likely go up to a 10-30 or 14-30 which would unambigously be for a level II plug-in EVSE and doesn't have the risk of someone plugging in the wrong thing.

gene6 said:
Are there any hard wired level 2 chargers that can be installed on a 2 pole 20 or even 2 pole 15?
Thanks
Click to expand...

Probably not, or not worth searching for. At those amps you will find plug-in chargers.
 
Thank you group.
jaggedben said:
To avoid potentially dealing with the lawyers *again*, I would likely go up to a 10-30 or 14-30 which would unambigously be for a level II
Click to expand...
I have not been to the place (its in another state), but the tenants electrician is saying the calculated load for the house is 84A and a level 2 changer *has* to be considered a 7200W load he can't install a level 2 charger on the 100A service and that a service upgrade is required. Its a 80's era GE panel if I remember correct.
Assuming the existing 84A is correct, would it be code to install a 14-30 and a label that says 16A max?
 
gene6 said:
Thank you group.

I have not been to the place (its in another state), but the tenants electrician is saying the calculated load for the house is 84A and a level 2 changer *has* to be considered a 7200W load he can't install a level 2 charger on the 100A service and that a service upgrade is required. Its a 80's era GE panel if I remember correct.
Assuming the existing 84A is correct, would it be code to install a 14-30 and a label that says 16A max?
Click to expand...
I understand, I kinda guessed this might be a factor. That said, a few points:

First, a 30A receptacle will only allow 24A of EV charging so it's 5760W not 7200.

Second, since the code does not address EV chargers in the optional calcs for dwellings (220.82 and 83), you could arguably count the 5760VA at 40% and then it's under 10A.

Third, if you can get meter data (Greenbutton) that shows the dwelling didn't consume more than 18kW average in any 15min period (or I would argue, 4.5kW for any hour period) then you couod use 220.87.

That said, *right* kind of 20A plug (the one on the top of Larry's pic, not the bottom!) would also work.
 
LarryFine said:
How? :unsure:

View attachment 2570169
Click to expand...
Funny pic, since it has two different types of receptacles on one yoke.
Google was confusing me and I admit to not being familiar with the designations.
So the top one is a 6-20R (right?) and would be fine.
What is the designation of the bottom one? Would you connect 240V to that? I wouldn't.

So okay, I agree, the right 20A plug exists. Just make sure it's the one you're getting.
 
"Incoming service capacity for a minimum level 2 electric vehicle charger"

The DOT website I think says typical 7kW and here is another that says 2.9kW:

Maybe I'm splitting words here, but "incoming service capacity" doesn't necessarily mean a device is in place, just that you can hook one up. If that the case, a box in the garage with one 20A 240V seems like it suffices. If you want to cut off debate, put in a 20A 240V receptable and buy a known brand L2 EV chrager that works up to 16A continous 240V and mount it there. I got one off craigslist from someone for cheap.
 
jaggedben said:
What is the designation of the bottom one? Would you connect 240V to that? I wouldn't.
Click to expand...
It's a NEMA 5-15R, and no, you would feed each half with the appropriate voltage.

You can supply it with 3 wires and share one line, or with 4 wires and not share one.
 
texie said:
According to the US DOT website, 7KW is the lowest level 2 charger recognized and 19 KW is the max.
Click to expand...
I'm a bit confused about those limits. There are scads of lower power ( < 7kW) L2 EVSEs on the market. Is it possible that you are looking at sites that use the word "Typical" for this range?

Like this DOT chart...

1708458477619.png



And if anybody might get confused about a 6-20R, just install a single receptacle (like Larry pictured above). Leave a 16A EVSE plugged in all the time and nobody will try and BFH the shop-vac plug into the unused duplex.

1708458698935.png
 
jaggedben said:
Second, since the code does not address EV chargers in the optional calcs for dwellings (220.82 and 83), you could arguably count the 5760VA at 40% and then it's under 10A.
Click to expand...

Ben is the optional service calculation then tied to the branch circuit ?
If I calculate the branch circuit one way for the optional service calc then the 100A service does not need to be replaced, is anything preventing the tenants electrician from just installing a larger 40A branch circuit (8 AWG romex) as long as the charger is programmed for correct amps?
 
gene6 said:
Ben is the optional service calculation then tied to the branch circuit ?
If I calculate the branch circuit one way for the optional service calc then the 100A service does not need to be replaced, is anything preventing the tenants electrician from just installing a larger 40A branch circuit (8 AWG romex) as long as the charger is programmed for correct amps?
Click to expand...
Well...
If it's a hardwired charger then yes.
But if it's a receptacle then the receptacle type tells the EVSE the max current avaliable (80% of receptacle rating), so then I'd say you can't do that, no. You have to assume that a plug-in charger will use 80% of the branch circuit rating.
 
readydave8 said:
Load shed might be cheaper than service upgrade or another lawsuit
Click to expand...
Yeah did not think of a load shed for residential,how does that work?
My cousin got himself into this mess because he threatened the tenant with eviction because they were using the front porch GFCI to charge and then tried to deny permission to have a charger installed.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top