SUB PANELS
- Thread starter pridelion
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Re: SUB PANELS
You bet you can. If the existing panel is full you will have to replace two existing breakers/circuits with a 2p breaker, commonly 60a, to feed the new sub-panel and relocating those breakers/circuits that were removed into the sub-panel.
The only consideration when doing this is the additional load. Is the existing service capable of handling it? If by chance if it's a 60a service definitely not. If it is a 100a service then it most likely will as the extra circuits are often outlets and lighting loads. Also it is not uncommon for the electrician to have installed a 20ckt 100a service entrance panel originally even though there are 30ckt 100a panels available. When they install the minimum panel you run out of space quickly. Thus, adding a subpanel most likely will not be an issue.
But you must consider your overall loads such as Electric heat which can be a biggy, A/C, Elec. dryer, elec. stove and oven, etc. If you don't have electric heat you most likely won't have a problem.
You bet you can. If the existing panel is full you will have to replace two existing breakers/circuits with a 2p breaker, commonly 60a, to feed the new sub-panel and relocating those breakers/circuits that were removed into the sub-panel.
The only consideration when doing this is the additional load. Is the existing service capable of handling it? If by chance if it's a 60a service definitely not. If it is a 100a service then it most likely will as the extra circuits are often outlets and lighting loads. Also it is not uncommon for the electrician to have installed a 20ckt 100a service entrance panel originally even though there are 30ckt 100a panels available. When they install the minimum panel you run out of space quickly. Thus, adding a subpanel most likely will not be an issue.
But you must consider your overall loads such as Electric heat which can be a biggy, A/C, Elec. dryer, elec. stove and oven, etc. If you don't have electric heat you most likely won't have a problem.
ramdiesel3500
Senior Member
- Location
- Bloomington IN
Re: SUB PANELS
I just finished adding a sub-panel in a residence this past weekend. The owner wanted critical loads moved to a subpanel so they can be fed by a portable generator via a transfer switch. No added load. I installed a 2-pole, 100A breaker in the main panel where I had removed branch breakers for the sub-panel. Then I fed the transfer switch utility line lugs from the new 100A breaker. I fed the new panel from the load lugs of the transfer switch. Once the owner decides on a generator, I will go back and install his standby feeder and inlet.
I just finished adding a sub-panel in a residence this past weekend. The owner wanted critical loads moved to a subpanel so they can be fed by a portable generator via a transfer switch. No added load. I installed a 2-pole, 100A breaker in the main panel where I had removed branch breakers for the sub-panel. Then I fed the transfer switch utility line lugs from the new 100A breaker. I fed the new panel from the load lugs of the transfer switch. Once the owner decides on a generator, I will go back and install his standby feeder and inlet.
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Re: SUB PANELS
In other words, if you need to add a significant electrical load, you will most likely need the upgrade. A sub-panel does nothing to increase the service ampacity.
Lion, yes, you can use a sub-panel to increase the quantity of circuits, or berakers, but this will NOT increase the capacity of the service.
In other words, if you need to add a significant electrical load, you will most likely need the upgrade. A sub-panel does nothing to increase the service ampacity.
ramdiesel3500
Senior Member
- Location
- Bloomington IN
Re: SUB PANELS
The panels I use have two isolated ground bars in them. These bars are connected together with a bonding bar. For any panel application that is not a service entrance panel, I remove the bonding bar so that I have two separate ground bars. I use one for the grounded (or neutral) conductors. I use the other for the grounding conductors and I install the green bonding screw on this bar as well so that the panel tub is properly grounded.
For the record, I do not like the term "bonding" screw. I think it should be called a "panel enclosure grounding" screw!
The panels I use have two isolated ground bars in them. These bars are connected together with a bonding bar. For any panel application that is not a service entrance panel, I remove the bonding bar so that I have two separate ground bars. I use one for the grounded (or neutral) conductors. I use the other for the grounding conductors and I install the green bonding screw on this bar as well so that the panel tub is properly grounded.
For the record, I do not like the term "bonding" screw. I think it should be called a "panel enclosure grounding" screw!
Re: SUB PANELS
The term "bonding screw" is correct. You are bonding the ground bar to the panel case. There is a movement to remove the term ground from the NEC except for those instances where we are talking about the connection to the earth. All other instances would be referred to as bonding. It would certainly eliminate some confusion.
The term "bonding screw" is correct. You are bonding the ground bar to the panel case. There is a movement to remove the term ground from the NEC except for those instances where we are talking about the connection to the earth. All other instances would be referred to as bonding. It would certainly eliminate some confusion.
ramdiesel3500
Senior Member
- Location
- Bloomington IN
Re: SUB PANELS
For me (and others I assume) the term bond has become synonomous with the connection that is made between the grounded conductors and the grounding system. I agree that some clarification is needed in order to make it all easier to understand!
For me (and others I assume) the term bond has become synonomous with the connection that is made between the grounded conductors and the grounding system. I agree that some clarification is needed in order to make it all easier to understand!
Re: SUB PANELS
I have installed a few 100 AMP outdoor subpanels to accomodate swimming pools and hot tubs. The 100 Amp panel provides a disconnecting means to comply with NEC, eliminates the need to crawl through the attic or crawlspace a second time when the client calls you in 6 months to add that hot tub he "might get someday", allows in ground pool installs to utilize the 240 V setup for the pump motor (I have had a few motors give me warranty trouble because they developed heat problems on 120 V), and provides a convient place to tap additional circuits for sheds, landscape lts., garages, etc.
My favorite was the couple who installed a pool in late March, then called me back to install 5 dedicated Christmas light circuits in early November. That sub panel probably saved them some money in the long run. It certainly saved me from using a great many foul words while crawling through their attic again.
I have installed a few 100 AMP outdoor subpanels to accomodate swimming pools and hot tubs. The 100 Amp panel provides a disconnecting means to comply with NEC, eliminates the need to crawl through the attic or crawlspace a second time when the client calls you in 6 months to add that hot tub he "might get someday", allows in ground pool installs to utilize the 240 V setup for the pump motor (I have had a few motors give me warranty trouble because they developed heat problems on 120 V), and provides a convient place to tap additional circuits for sheds, landscape lts., garages, etc.
My favorite was the couple who installed a pool in late March, then called me back to install 5 dedicated Christmas light circuits in early November. That sub panel probably saved them some money in the long run. It certainly saved me from using a great many foul words while crawling through their attic again.
LawnGuyLandSparky
Senior Member
Re: SUB PANELS
What brand WP sub did you use? I was kinda miffed that my 100a pool/spa subpanel rated @ 100a holds only 8 1" breakers. Sure, could use twins but since most breakers in this situation are the GFCI type...
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