Suitability for use in hazardous areas?
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petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
the electrical code does not cover flashlights.
- Location
- Mission Viejo, CA
- Occupation
- Professional Electrical Engineer
For a long time, the Scope of Article 500 (500.1) seemed to imply that Articles 500 to 504 only applied to installations. It now states clearly that they apply to equipment as well. Combine that with 2020 NEC Section 500.4 Informational Note No. 5 and Section 500.8(B), especially 500.8(B)(1) and 500.8(C), and draw your own conclusions.
Personally, I wouldn't use it.
Personally, I wouldn't use it.
- Location
- Mission Viejo, CA
- Occupation
- Professional Electrical Engineer
You beat me to the reply Bob but see my response.
- Location
- Mission Viejo, CA
- Occupation
- Professional Electrical Engineer
I should note that, while 2020 NEC Section 500.4 Informational Note No. 5 isn't technically enforceable, Section 500.8(B) definitely is.
Thanks for the responses and perspective because I was not even looking at it from an equipment perspective - was looking at the LED component and wondering if by default LEDs were considered simple apparatus as per the definition in NEC or does it have to meet the specific V/KW requirements outlined in the definition of simple apparatus
"Simple Apparatus [as applied to Hazardous (Classified) Locations]. An electrical component or combination of components of simple construction with well-defined electrical parameters that does not generate more than 1.5 volts, 100 mA, and 25 mW, or a passive component that does not dissipate more than 1.3 watts and is compatible with the intrinsic safety of the circuit in which it is used. (CMP-14)
Informational Note: The following apparatus are examples of simple apparatus:
(1) Passive components; for example, switches, junction
boxes, resistance temperature devices, and simple semi‐
conductor devices such as LEDs
(2) Sources of stored energy consisting of single components
in simple circuits with well-defined parameters; for exam‐
ple, capacitors or inductors, whose values are considered
when determining the overall safety of the system
(3) Sources of generated energy; for example, thermocouples
and photocells, that do not generate more than 1.5 volts,
100 mA, and 25 mW"
- Location
- Mission Viejo, CA
- Occupation
- Professional Electrical Engineer
If it were IS or NI, it would have been advertised as such.
Ok, I was always of the impression that if it was considered to be IS or NI based on meeting the criteria of simple apparatus as defined by NEC, then it did not have to be marked. Thanks for clarifying that for me.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
- Occupation
- EC
IMO NEC still doesn't apply to this simply because it is not premises wiring. Though not exactly worded that way 90.2 still kind says that NEC covers things that are installed/are a part of the premises. Some other standard for handling the hazardous location still applies though - no expert on exactly what those might be. Bottom line is in some situations you don't want anything that is potentially spark producing or that may operate above ignition point of the hazardous component whether that item is electrical or not.
n1ist
Senior Member
- Location
- Massachusetts
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- Principal Electrical Engineer
If it has a white LED, the forward voltage would be over 1.5V; it likely runs on a 3V lithium like a CR2032 or a pair of 1.5V button cells.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
I don't see how a flashlight qualifies as "equipment".
But I would not be using such a flashlight in a classified area.
A lot of places ban anything with a battery in classified areas unless it is identified for that area.
A lot of places ban matches and lighters in classified areas too. Don't think those are covered in the NEC. But, a clear hazard.
- Location
- Mission Viejo, CA
- Occupation
- Professional Electrical Engineer
A. While Section 90.2 may be a bit ambivalent concerning equipment use versus "installations," Section 90.3 Code Arrangement states: "… Chapters 1, 2, 3, and 4 apply generally. Chapters 5, 6, and 7 apply to special occupancies, special equipment, or other special conditions and may supplement or modify the requirements in Chapters 1 through 7."
B. About the definition of equipment, but for the niggling word "installations" at the end, equipment would clearly include flashlights. Unfortunately, "installations" is not defined for the NEC, so we are left with the Mirriam-Webster, 11th Collegiate Dictionary (the official NFPA dictionary for standard terms). The route is circuitous, but the conclusion is the same: a flashlight used in a Classified Location is "installed."
That is:
Definition of installation:
1: the act of installing: the state of being installed
2: something that is installed for use
Base Definition of install:
1: to set up for use or service
If we need to dig deeper to define use, let me know.
C. While an LED may be a simple apparatus, it may only be part of an IS or NI system where a control drawing permits it.
NOTE: It is usually my habit to italicize NEC defined words and words used as words.
B. About the definition of equipment, but for the niggling word "installations" at the end, equipment would clearly include flashlights. Unfortunately, "installations" is not defined for the NEC, so we are left with the Mirriam-Webster, 11th Collegiate Dictionary (the official NFPA dictionary for standard terms). The route is circuitous, but the conclusion is the same: a flashlight used in a Classified Location is "installed."
That is:
Definition of installation:
1: the act of installing: the state of being installed
2: something that is installed for use
Base Definition of install:
1: to set up for use or service
If we need to dig deeper to define use, let me know.
C. While an LED may be a simple apparatus, it may only be part of an IS or NI system where a control drawing permits it.
NOTE: It is usually my habit to italicize NEC defined words and words used as words.
you are quite correct... CR2032
Ok, I understand. Thanks for taking the time to explain.
Noted. Thanks for the clarification
Thanks for the guidance.
Fred B
Senior Member
- Location
- Upstate, NY
- Occupation
- Electrician
How is a can of spray lubricant being "installed"? As mentioned what you have is a glorified flashlight that aids in seeing your point of spraying of the lubricant.
"1: a small battery-operated portable electric light"
NEC 2017 has no references to flashlight or battery operated electri light.
The lubricant itself maybe restricted from use in a classified area but would have nothing to do with NEC persea. Restriction as a result of potential sparking of the flashlight is again not within the realm of the NEC for a flashlight.
Myself I could see this as a useful tool for mechanical work in dark recesses to help reduce overspray by helping you to target application of the lubricant.
Are we suggesting that the NEC be involved in "regulating" what is essentially a flashlight? My cat won't be happy with that if I can't use that cheap little LED laser pointer for her to chase.
Marriam Webster
Definition of flashlight
"1: a small battery-operated portable electric light"
NEC 2017 has no references to flashlight or battery operated electri light.
The lubricant itself maybe restricted from use in a classified area but would have nothing to do with NEC persea. Restriction as a result of potential sparking of the flashlight is again not within the realm of the NEC for a flashlight.
Myself I could see this as a useful tool for mechanical work in dark recesses to help reduce overspray by helping you to target application of the lubricant.
Are we suggesting that the NEC be involved in "regulating" what is essentially a flashlight? My cat won't be happy with that if I can't use that cheap little LED laser pointer for her to chase.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
- Occupation
- EC
That little light is electrically operated. It also does not fit the scope of NEC, as part of that assembly anyway.
It still could be something prohibited in some other code concerning some hazardous locations, anything spark producing or operating over ignition temperature of the gas is a concern in those locations. There could also be situations where one could temporarily ventilate that allows for some maintenance type activities that aren't otherwise allowed in general.
So bottom line is this little light not covered by NEC, though it could still not be compliant with some other safety codes for the location. Some similar terminology may apply to those other codes that NEC also uses, like intrinsically safe. If this product never been tested for use in hazardous location it won't have any such listing/labeling though as is it still possibly could pass. You can bet if it were tested and listed for the application that the price tag goes up though.
Noted. Not suggesting that NEC should regulate flashlights. I misinterpreted NEC's definition of simple apparatus and was trying to rationalize the safety of the use of the LED at a component level. It's clear to me now that I cannot do that. Thanks.
GeorgeB
ElectroHydraulics engineer (retired)
- Location
- Greenville SC
- Occupation
- Retired
There are many single cell LED flashlights that operate well from a conventional 1.0-1.5V cell. I've always assumed there was some sort of current limited voltage doubler inside. I've one on my keychain with a single AAA that isn't much larger; the electronics cannot be large. I use this one, about $10 from multiple sources.
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