Supporting 2x2 and 2x4 Troffers

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goldstar

goldstar

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New Jersey
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Electrical Contractor
I'm replacing 2x2 and 2x4 fluorescent troffers in an office with LED troffers. The original troffers had two small sheet metal screws on each side of the troffer attaching them to the ceiling grid. The design of new LED troffers I'm installing do not have ample space on their surface to install a screw without it protruding into the fixture itself. Am I required to independently support each troffer with wire to the ceiling above or can I use the clips on the fixture as shown in this general instruction sheet http://gc-lighting.com/wp-content/uploads/GREEN-CREATIVE-LED-Troffer-Installation-Instructions-1.pdf ? There were no manufacturer's installation instructions that came packaged with the troffers and I have no way of knowing what the ceiling grid rating is.

Thanks in advance for your opinions.
 
The NEC will require you to secure the fixture to the grid; building codes will require the fixtures to be supported to the structure of the building.

I would suggest both.
 
goldstar said:
I'm replacing 2x2 and 2x4 fluorescent troffers in an office with LED troffers. The original troffers had two small sheet metal screws on each side of the troffer attaching them to the ceiling grid. The design of new LED troffers I'm installing do not have ample space on their surface to install a screw without it protruding into the fixture itself. Am I required to independently support each troffer with wire to the ceiling above or can I use the clips on the fixture as shown in this general instruction sheet http://gc-lighting.com/wp-content/uploads/GREEN-CREATIVE-LED-Troffer-Installation-Instructions-1.pdf ? There were no manufacturer's installation instructions that came packaged with the troffers and I have no way of knowing what the ceiling grid rating is.

Thanks in advance for your opinions.
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The clips are a listed means of securing the fixture to the grid. So you don't need to use screws, regardless of the "opinion" of the local inspection. Independently supporting the fixture to the deck above is a building code issue not and NEC one. The rules are different for each municipality. Some places they are called seismic wires. Other places they are called hurricane wires, and for all I know they are something else in other places.
 
KP2 said:
The NEC will require you to secure the fixture to the grid; building codes will require the fixtures to be supported to the structure of the building.

I would suggest both.
Click to expand...

^^ This ^^
 
410.36(B) Luminarairs shall be securely fastened to the ceiling grid member by mechanical means such as bolts, screws, or rivets.
Listed clips IDENTIFIED FOR USE WITH THAT TYPE OF CEILING FRAMING MEMBER AND LUMINAIRIE shall be permitted.
If you can document the clip is listed for the manufacture of the grid or put a screw in it.

Can you put the screws in the other direction towards the other tile?

In Vegas 2 grid wires and 2 screws per lay-in required to pass.
The fixture clips alone or Caddy clips are a no go.
 
I managed to find a spot on the troffers where I could shoot a self tapping screw in, so I attached them to the grid. These are replacement troffers and not new construction so IMHO I'm replacing like with like (but I'm sure my opinion counts for squat). The original troffers were screwed into the grid so basically I did the same thing. I have a call into the bldg. dept. and I'll wait to see what they say. Thanks for all your replies.
 
active1 said:
410.36(B) Luminarairs shall be securely fastened to the ceiling grid member by mechanical means such as bolts, screws, or rivets.
Listed clips IDENTIFIED FOR USE WITH THAT TYPE OF CEILING FRAMING MEMBER AND LUMINAIRIE shall be permitted.
If you can document the clip is listed for the manufacture of the grid or put a screw in it.

Can you put the screws in the other direction towards the other tile?

In Vegas 2 grid wires and 2 screws per lay-in required to pass.
The fixture clips alone or Caddy clips are a no go.
Click to expand...

First, I have never seen a troffer that has clips to secure to the grid that are identified for use with grid. Second, in Las Vegas is there actually an amendment to the NEC that requires to screws or is this something the local inspectors make up that isn't worth challenging? Here in Florida, the only way a local jurisdiction can make a restriction stronger than the code is for the State to write it specifically in the Florida Building Code, for example, in Florida, 2% feeder and 3% branch voltage drop is a code not a suggestion.
 
Strathead said:
First, I have never seen a troffer that has clips to secure to the grid that are identified for use with grid. Second, in Las Vegas is there actually an amendment to the NEC that requires to screws or is this something the local inspectors make up that isn't worth challenging? Here in Florida, the only way a local jurisdiction can make a restriction stronger than the code is for the State to write it specifically in the Florida Building Code, for example, in Florida, 2% feeder and 3% branch voltage drop is a code not a suggestion.
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Clips not identified for the grid. EXACTLY.
Even the Caddy 515 & 515A clips are not identified for any particular ceiling frame member.
They call them the original earthquake clip from 1975.
The current 515 instructions dated 1994 reads "NOTE: FOR POSITIONING ONLY".
The sales sheet for the 515 / 515A has at the bottom "NO LOAD RATING - POSITIONING ONLY".
The same sale sheet says "COMPLIES WITH NEC ARTICLE 410-16 MEANS OF SUPPORT"
Except that reference goes back to at least the 1999 NEC when dashes were used and 410.16 was not about closet lighting.
https://www.erico.com/globalSearch.asp?keywords=515

So no there is no amendment here for screws. But clips themselves are a no go here.
 
Originally Posted by KP2
The NEC will require you to secure the fixture to the grid; building codes will require the fixtures to be supported to the structure of the building.

I would suggest both.
Click to expand...

gadfly56 said:
^^ This ^^
Click to expand...
FYI, I stopped in at the bldg. dept. and inquired about this. The BI said he couldn't find anything in the IBC that would require me to secure the troffers to the building structure. In addition he mentioned that in my case, seeing as how it was a retrofit, it would probably fall under the NJ Rehab Code and I can replace like with like. So, unless tha EI tells me that I have to make the extra support and backs it up with a Code reference, they are screwed into the grid.
 
goldstar said:
FYI, I stopped in at the bldg. dept. and inquired about this. The BI said he couldn't find anything in the IBC that would require me to secure the troffers to the building structure. In addition he mentioned that in my case, seeing as how it was a retrofit, it would probably fall under the NJ Rehab Code and I can replace like with like. So, unless tha EI tells me that I have to make the extra support and backs it up with a Code reference, they are screwed into the grid.
Click to expand...

You forgot to mention that part! :p

The requirements for suspended ceilings are in the IBC at section 808. That references ANSI C635/C636. I even took it out of the NJ edition of the IBC. Pass it along and impress the BI with your command of the code. Considering how old that ANSI standard is it was probably in force since NJ adopted the UCC.

ceiling grid.jpg
 
gadfly56 said:
You forgot to mention that part! :p

The requirements for suspended ceilings are in the IBC at section 808. That references ASTM C635/C636. I even took it out of the NJ edition of the IBC. Pass it along and impress the BI with your command of the code. Considering how old that ANSI standard is it was probably in force since NJ adopted the UCC.

View attachment 17275
Click to expand...

minor correction:) this means spending a bunch of money on another standard, because it doesn't come cheaply.
 
Independent fixture wiring support- it all depends on what level of the seismic scale your area is determined to be , level one thru 4 as per IBC. 4 being the worst case. Level one and two , wires are not required to the fixture if the grid is supported within 3 inches of each corner of the light. Level 3 - two wires. Level 4- four wires.
 
Strathead said:
minor correction:) this means spending a bunch of money on another standard, because it doesn't come cheaply.
Click to expand...

I looked it up, and at $45 it's cheap compared to most others. The UL864 standard for fire alarm panels (among other things) is $505 in PDF, $631 in hard copy. None of that UL pricing includes subscriptions or updates.
 
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