surge suppressor

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rippledipple

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Hello gang,does anyone know approx. how many hits a leviton 51120-1 surge suppressor can take? I want to sell something thats gonna last.I haven't had good luck with others in the past.
 
There is no way to rate them in such a way. Most are rated in how many joules they can withstand; it could take several small surges or one giant surge.

We just use whatever the manufacturer of the gear offers that will install on the bus.

For small existing service jobs I've sold APT tvss.


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There is no way to rate them in such a way. Most are rated in how many joules they can withstand; it could take several small surges or one giant surge.

We just use whatever the manufacturer of the gear offers that will install on the bus.

For small existing service jobs I've sold APT tvss.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I more or less agree. I think you can get indicators on some units that will flag if the thing has failed. That might be your best option if you are worried about failures.
 
I more or less agree. I think you can get indicators on some units that will flag if the thing has failed. That might be your best option if you are worried about failures.
I agree. There are some that provide a "Surge Counter" that tells you how many hits it has suppressed, but in all the ones I have installed, there is nothing in the manual telling you what that value means! I always chuckle when I see a Consultant insist on having the counter feature. The only value they provide is if someone is rigorous about periodically recording the Surge Count and if they see a change in the value over a similar time period, it gives you something to look for. Other than that, they are pointless with regard to life of the device.

Even the "Remaining Life Indicators" are basically just an idiot light. It will say 100% life, right up until the moment it says 0% life. So what they are good for is just letting you know they are no longer there. I prefer the versions that give you a status contact, because then you can wire them to a pilot light or a relay that lets someone know they are toast and need replacement.
 
On the MOV's we use in our products the spec sheet tells us what hit it will take on the first hit, what hit it will take on the 2nd hit and nothing after that. The problem is nobody ever knows if they took a hit unless there is damage. That being said, your choices are to open up the device and look for the bulge, or replace them periodically.

We have SPD's on each of our two 3 phase services. I intend to open them up this winter and inspect the MOV's (assuming that's what's in there).

Question: Has anyone ever wired MOV's directly into a panel at the lugs? Seems if they made a lug with a tap to run some MOV's L-L and L-N it would be an equitable means to provide surge protection as well as a revenue generating endeavor for EC's because you could do an annual service call inspection on them. You could probably parallel them in there too.
 
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Question: Has anyone ever wired MOV's directly into a panel at the lugs? Seems if they made a lug with a tap to run some MOV's L-L and L-N it would be an equitable means to provide surge protection as well as a revenue generating endeavor for EC's because you could do an annual service call inspection on them. You could probably parallel them in there too.
Not a great idea. MOVs work by sacrificing themselves, sometimes violently. I've seen loose MOVs that have vaporized and coated everything with a layer of conductive material, creating a secondary flash over when power was restored. that's why most SPDs are potted or at least encased in a can of some sort.
 
Not a great idea. MOVs work by sacrificing themselves, sometimes violently....

And that's one reason why some types of SPD are only listed to be installed downstream of the main breaker, or more restrictively, on the load side of their own branch breaker while others (more expensive!) are listed to be connected on the line side of the main.
 
Thank you gentlemen.
That's some good information to have.
So are you saying if I open up the CH SPD's on my 2 x 3phase services I'm not going to be able to do a visual to see if they've absorbed any transients?
 
Thank you gentlemen.
That's some good information to have.
So are you saying if I open up the CH SPD's on my 2 x 3phase services I'm not going to be able to do a visual to see if they've absorbed any transients?
Not likely you will be reinstalling same ones afterwards if you go to the means necessary to get any good information about their condition.
 
Not a great idea. MOVs work by sacrificing themselves, sometimes violently. I've seen loose MOVs that have vaporized and coated everything with a layer of conductive material, creating a secondary flash over when power was restored. that's why most SPDs are potted or at least encased in a can of some sort.

We had one customer who must have been in just the right spot. Every year or thereabouts we'd get a service call for a fried panel. Again. It was much as you describe, MOV's exploded and the interior of the panel was coated with residue.
 
160915-1152 EDT

Following is a very good discussion:
http://www.littelfuse.com/~/media/e...n_devices_and_principles_application_note.pdf

Transient limiting can work at energy levels up toward the energy rating of the transient limiter (this is a power dissipation, temperature rise, within the transient limitier problem), and probably tolerate up to that energy level for a large number of hits.

When the energy level rating of the limiter is reached, then the number of hits tolerated at this levrel is probably greatly reduced compared to lower levels. How a manufacturer defines their rating will define what to expect.

Go some ways above the nominal rating and failure (exploding) will occur on 1 transient hit.


Recently I had two tramsient limiter outlet strips fail the same day, almost certainly at the same instant, These were on two different circuits at opposite ends of the house from the main panel. Both limiters had internal fuses of some kind that opend when the MOV failed. Thus, the load was disconnected from the source.

Parallel MOVs were used in the outlet strips. Only one or two MOVs failed in each case. The outlet strips were different brands. Essentially both strips were destroyed, and both had been in operation for possibly 16 or more years.

To make valid statements about MOVs or other transient limiters you need to underestand what are their characteristics, how do they limit transients, and really how big are transients after limiting. The Littelfuse discussion provides you good information.

.
 
Thank you gentlemen.
That's some good information to have.
So are you saying if I open up the CH SPD's on my 2 x 3phase services I'm not going to be able to do a visual to see if they've absorbed any transients?

Maybe. It depends on the energy involved in the spike that took them out. High enough and the MOVs will be just a burn spot. Middle level, maybe just discoloration, but only discernible if you have something to compare it to, i.e. red may turn grey, blue may turn brown, but if they started out brown, that may mean they are good. Different Mfrs use different colors. Very low energy, you may not be able to tell by looking at all. Generally though if there are more than one in the box, only one will be bad, so it's the difference that will ket you know.
 
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Hello gang,does anyone know approx. how many hits a leviton 51120-1 surge suppressor can take? I want to sell something thats gonna last.I haven't had good luck with others in the past.

Here is the spec sheet:

https://www.1000bulbs.com/pdf/leviton-51120-specs.pdf

How many surges cant be determined imo as it would depend on surge intensity. The limited lifetime warranty makes me believe these almost bulletproof, but the skeptic in me says anything electrical (and at their price point) can be destroyed or overloaded with one really extreme surge.

I would think the ability to protect equipment from surges more important than its lifespan. If this box could take a direct lightning hit, and none of the customers high end electronics or appliances got fried, but it did, it did its job.
 
Not sure, we got the call after the fire department.
No damage to any of the loads on the panel, so it is possible it was just its time.
 
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