It has been brought to my attention that a customer has requested that they do not want any of the circuits we install to share neutrals. This includes dirty and clean power alike. Normally they only wanted #10 individual neutrals for the 20A computer circuits. This is a three phase wye system. Is this a good plan or not and why?
To share or not to share
- Thread starter gregr
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jtester
Senior Member
- Location
- Las Cruces N.M.
Re: To share or not to share
What kind of a customer do you have? I can think of a few who deserved dedicated neutrals, but many times it would be a waste of money.
Jim T
What kind of a customer do you have? I can think of a few who deserved dedicated neutrals, but many times it would be a waste of money.
Jim T
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: To share or not to share
Seems a bit costly but no reason it would cause a problem other than pipe fill and the need of a large neutral bar
Seems a bit costly but no reason it would cause a problem other than pipe fill and the need of a large neutral bar
peter d
Senior Member
- Location
- New England
Re: To share or not to share
They might get a little anxious after you explain that their service and feeders are all big multiwire circuits.
[ January 24, 2005, 05:49 PM: Message edited by: peter d ]
Did they explain their rationale?
They might get a little anxious after you explain that their service and feeders are all big multiwire circuits.
[ January 24, 2005, 05:49 PM: Message edited by: peter d ]
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- Semi-retired engineer
Re: To share or not to share
I prefer circuits run like this. it simplifies commissioning and debug. I'm not sure I understand why 20A circuits are being run in #10, unless its a VD thing. I also prefer to see such circuits run in seperate pipes. In my case, I usually only have a few circuits so its not a big issue.
To me, the little bit of added cost is well worth the time savings when it comes to startup. I want nothing that might impede a smooth startup.
But for general lighting and outlets it seems overkill cause I just don't care how long it takes the EC to get them running as long as my stuff is functional.
I prefer circuits run like this. it simplifies commissioning and debug. I'm not sure I understand why 20A circuits are being run in #10, unless its a VD thing. I also prefer to see such circuits run in seperate pipes. In my case, I usually only have a few circuits so its not a big issue.
To me, the little bit of added cost is well worth the time savings when it comes to startup. I want nothing that might impede a smooth startup.
But for general lighting and outlets it seems overkill cause I just don't care how long it takes the EC to get them running as long as my stuff is functional.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- Semi-retired engineer
Re: To share or not to share
I don't really care about the multiwire aspect of the circuits so much as I want to be able to track down and/or replace wires quickly during startup.
If there are one set of wires in a pipe that go directly from point A to point B it is much easier to fix if there is a problem, over having 10 wires in the same pipe.
Call me paranoid, but when each added day of startup can cost $10,000 or more, I opt for making it faster to track things down, over saving a few bucks.
Ever try to fish out one conductor that has failed the megger test out of a pipe with 10 wires in it? Its just about impossible, but you can yank all three wires out and run new ones pretty quick.
I don't really care about the multiwire aspect of the circuits so much as I want to be able to track down and/or replace wires quickly during startup.
If there are one set of wires in a pipe that go directly from point A to point B it is much easier to fix if there is a problem, over having 10 wires in the same pipe.
Call me paranoid, but when each added day of startup can cost $10,000 or more, I opt for making it faster to track things down, over saving a few bucks.
Ever try to fish out one conductor that has failed the megger test out of a pipe with 10 wires in it? Its just about impossible, but you can yank all three wires out and run new ones pretty quick.
physis
Senior Member
Re: To share or not to share
I can see your point there. But.
When I run anything, I test it.
Additional stuff is going up and things can happen to my work and if my work wasn't known to be good I could be responsible for making it work again. Whoever's fault it might have been.
Isn't it typical protocol to know things work?
I'm sure it's a little different in a plant compared to a residence, but the concept is the same.
I can see your point there. But.
When I run anything, I test it.
Additional stuff is going up and things can happen to my work and if my work wasn't known to be good I could be responsible for making it work again. Whoever's fault it might have been.
Isn't it typical protocol to know things work?
I'm sure it's a little different in a plant compared to a residence, but the concept is the same.
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