Two bldgs served by one meter?

olc

Senior Member
Two buildings (same owner, same property) fed from the same pad mount transformer with an adjacent meter. Transformer and meter located half way between the buildings.
For this example lets say 240V, 1Phase, one has a 100A service and one has a 200A service but the total load for both (added together) is less than 200A, so the meter is 200A.
Each building has a main disconnect/over current protection at the building.
Does there need to be any additional disconnect (with or without over current) at the meter?
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Well it's really up to the AHJ and the power company

The AHJ could say the meter pedestal is a structure and that would kick in a requirement for the disconnect.

The power company could have rules that require one.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Until there is a disconnect they are service conductors.
Yes, and service conductors at a structure require a disconnecting means.

So if the AHJ decides the meter pedestal is a structure the service disconnect will have to be located there.

I am not saying the AHJ should or will see it that way only that they can due to the NEC and building codes definition of structure.
 

ActionDave

Moderator
Staff member
AHJ can't call anything anything on the utility side. He can stand on, sit on it, yell at it, kick it, curse it, curse at me, curse the sky, tear his garments and throw ashes on his head. Until the conductors hit a disconnect it doesn't matter.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
AHJ can't call anything anything on the utility side. He can stand on, sit on it, yell at it, kick it, curse it, curse at me, curse the sky, tear his garments and throw ashes on his head. Until the conductors hit a disconnect it doesn't matter.
Dave, the service point is generally ahead of the meter.

If what you are saying is true the NEC would never apply to service conductors.
 

GoldDigger

Moderator
Staff member
Dave, the service point is generally ahead of the meter.

If what you are saying is true the NEC would never apply to service conductors.
Depends...
For overhead the service point may well be the splice going into the weatherhead.
For underground it might not be before the input or *output* lugs of the meter base.
But it is very true that the service point is almost always ahead of the service disconnect, while the conductors are still service conductors up to the disconnect. From a practical standpoint, they remain service conductors up to the OCPD associated with the disconnect, regardless of which side of the switch the OCPD is located on.
 

olc

Senior Member
Thanks for the replies.
Are the conductors from the meter to the disconnect not "service entrance conductors?

Related question - If I just put a disconnect just on the load side of the meter (for one bldg.) does that disconnect enclosure get bonded to the ground at the transformer (and meter)?
 

GoldDigger

Moderator
Staff member
Thanks for the replies.
Are the conductors from the meter to the disconnect not "service entrance conductors?

Related question - If I just put a disconnect just on the load side of the meter (for one bldg.) does that disconnect enclosure get bonded to the ground at the transformer (and meter)?
Look at the definitions for service, service drop, etc. in the NEC.
They are service conductors, but may not be other more detailed types depending on the type of wiring and the location of the contractual service point.

Re your second question, whose transformer?
The GEC(s) from the GES need to bonded somewhere between the meter and the first disconnect that has OCPD (the service disconnect.)
 
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electrofelon

Senior Member
The AHJ could say the meter pedestal is a structure and that would kick in a requirement for the disconnect.
Hold on - where does it say a structure necessarily needs a service disconnect? I can run service conductors on the outside of a building, not serve the building with them and not need a disconnect. See 230.3
 

ActionDave

Moderator
Staff member
Dave, the service point is generally ahead of the meter.

If what you are saying is true the NEC would never apply to service conductors.
I say not in this case. The meter pedestal is strictly property of the utility.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Yes. Had a fight with one inspector who was bound and determined to make us run 200A wire from a meter ped to a small service because the pedestal had a 200A breaker in it.
Well they still may well have been correct and you got away with something.

The location and ownership of the metering equipment has absolutely nothing to do with where the NEC starts.

The NEC starts at the 'service point' and as Golddigger mentioned with a service lateral that point is often the load side of the meter. I think you where in violation.

By the way, I think your mention of 230.40 is likely the real deal breaker here.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Hold on - where does it say a structure necessarily needs a service disconnect? I can run service conductors on the outside of a building, not serve the building with them and not need a disconnect. See 230.3
That is a very interesting point and I have a lot of thoughts about with no time to talk about it now.

I will say that 230.3 has nothing to do with the topic of this thread. These conductors are not passing through any building or structure so that section does not apply or prove the point no disconnect is needed.
 

electrofelon

Senior Member
That is a very interesting point and I have a lot of thoughts about with no time to talk about it now.

I will say that 230.3 has nothing to do with the topic of this thread. These conductors are not passing through any building or structure so that section does not apply or prove the point no disconnect is needed.
Right they are not passing through a building so there is no disconnect required. What code section requires a disconnect?
 

david

Senior Member
Right they are not passing through a building so there is no disconnect required. What code section requires a disconnect?
I thought 230.3 would have relevance in the discussion.

230.6 Conductors Considered Outside the Building.

230.70 General.
Means shall be provided to disconnect all conductors in a building or other structure from the service-entrance conductors.
225.31 Disconnecting Means.
Means shall be provided for disconnecting all ungrounded conductors that supply or pass through the building or structure.
 
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