up to six duplex receptacles ?

andy32821 · Aug 1, 2005

The City of Winter Park has a website that list the most common violations of the NEC. It seems to be talking to homeowners.

http://www.ci.winter-park.fl.us/2002/depts/code.shtml#elec

This is on their list.
_____________________________
Excessive number of outlets on one circuit.

The Code allows up to six duplex receptacles or 10 lights or combinations of up to five receptacles and three lights on one circuit to allow a safe amount of electrical current to feed this system without over-taxing the circuit.

______________________________________

Can anyone tell me how they came up with this?

roger · Aug 1, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

This was from the South Florida Building Code, I think this has gone out the window now that Fl has addopted the NEC across the board ( not I said I think)

Roger

petersonra · Aug 1, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

here's two more on their list I question.

Improper or inadequate support of electrical wiring systems.
Romex cable must be secured within seven inches of boxes and every four feet thereafter according to the Code.

I thought it was six inches.

Improper installation of ceiling fans.
Use of a UL-approved fan box is required.

I did not know UL approved anything. They do list stuff.

yoopersup · Aug 1, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

2002 N.E.C. 314.17 Exception 2 1/4 X 4inch single gang is within 8 inches . Also see 334.30 12 inches on rest.

physis · Aug 1, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

I'm not even looking it up.

Within 12 inches of termination.

8 inches for those plastic boxes with clampless holes.

And 4 1/2 feet securing and supporting.

charlie b · Aug 1, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

Here are some more observations:

Overfill of switch boxes with excessive number of wires. The Code requires that electrical switch boxes be sized large enough to all wiring that terminates in a box.

Don't you also have to take into account the wires that pass through the box without terminating?

Lack of or improper connections used for bonding wires. The Code requires that bonding wires be mechanically connected to provide a safe ground for the electrical system.

I think we are confusing "bonding" and "grounding" here.

Lack of ground fault protection on bathroom, kitchen, garage, and outside receptacles. The Code requires the provision of special, stray current protection against electrical shock in areas where use of appliances is likely.

I would not call a weed whacker an "appliance." Also, I would not call the shock a person might receive from a broken weed whacker "stray current."

Unlicensed workers on a job. The local Code requires that a licensed journeyman plumber be on every (plumbing) job to ensure good workmanship.

But they don't require that there be a licensed journeyman electrician on every electrical job? And the reason for having a journeyman is to assure good workmanship, not to assure code compliance? Go figure.

physis · Aug 1, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

I didn't look at the list until Charlie's post. I think these kind of lists are a good idea for professional, unprofessionals, even inspectors. There's tons of stuff everybody has to know. It's really hard to know everything. Contractors are as bad as DIYers sometimes too. I've worked for some so don't bother trying to correct me.

hurk27 · Aug 2, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

From the site in the link:
The Code allows up to six duplex receptacles or 10 lights or combinations of up to five receptacles and three lights on one circuit to allow a safe amount of electrical current to feed this system without over-taxing the circuit.

If they only allow 10 lights then do you have to feed a chandler that has 12 lights with two circuits???

Inadequate working clearances around panels and electrical equipment.
A minimum of three feet in front of panels or equipment and 30 inches of working space to the side is required to provide a safe working area for service.

A working space that is 74.5" wide (30+30+14.5 panel) and 30" deep? Might as well have a dedicated room for it. :roll:

George Stolz · Aug 2, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

Originally posted by charlie b:


Lack of ground fault protection on bathroom, kitchen, garage, and outside receptacles. The Code requires the provision of special, stray current protection against electrical shock in areas where use of appliances is likely.

I would not call a weed whacker an "appliance." Also, I would not call the shock a person might receive from a broken weed whacker "stray current."

What is an appliance, Charlie? I would technically consider a weed-eater an appliance.

I tend to describe ground-fault situations as "stray current", to better describe the function of a GFI.

charlie b · Aug 2, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

Originally posted by georgestolz: What is an appliance, Charlie? I would technically consider a weed-eater an appliance. I tend to describe ground-fault situations as "stray current", to better describe the function of a GFI.

As you wish. It's just a matter of choice, in the interpretation of our far-too-open-to-interpretation language. Here's my perspective:

Neither the NEC definition nor that in my office dictionary would exclude a weed whacker from being an "appliance." But I still wouldn't use that word. Some time back, I got into a discussion in which I proposed applying the word "appliance" to an under-counter puck light. But I don't believe it really applies. If you allow every single thing that might fit into the NEC's definition to be called an "appliance," then you would include table lamps, table saws, irons, soldering irons, glue guns, staple guns, coffee mills, treadmills, MP3 players, and player pianos ? essentially anything in the world that is plug and cord connected, and many things that are hard-wired. The common, English, conversational meaning of "appliance" is too firmly instilled in my mind to accept such things. To me, a fridge is an appliance, and a stereo is not. After all, if you shop at any major department store, you won't find stereos in the "appliance department."

But I had only picked that example to pick upon the author of those strange guidelines.

As to "stray current," to me that term means unexpected current from an unknown, and possibly untraceable, source. Stray current is what shocks you, when you're swimming in a marina. It's what shocks cows standing in a field. When a weed whacker goes bad, the result is a "ground fault," with the unfortunate operator being part of the fault path. To say that it is "current gone astray" is true enough. To call it "stray current" for the purposes of explaining the phenomenon to a novice is not out of line. But it is not precise, not accurate, IMHO.

George Stolz · Aug 2, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

Originally posted by charlie b:
To say that it is "current gone astray" is true enough. To call it "stray current" for the purposes of explaining the phenomenon to a novice is not out of line. But it is not precise, not accurate, IMHO.

True. I guess I'll probably wind up curbing my vocab a little bit.

charlie b · Aug 3, 2005

Re: up to six duplex receptacles ?

No need for that. But what we all need to keep in mind is that there is a difference between "loose, conversational, slang, or otherwise imprecise" language and the "formal, precise" language of the code. We need to be sure that both speaker and listener, both writer and reader, are using the same language at the same time.

up to six duplex receptacles ?

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