Using cable stackers horizontally

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shermansfather

shermansfather

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Northeast Ohio
Greetings,
I have viewed some threads regarding the capacity or non-capacity (in the case of 3M SIFS with 14-3 & 12-3 cables). I'm asking if anyone uses or has had EI issues using these horizontally along floor joists or rafters. I've had a few funny looks from EI's but no comments (I prefer to let the inspector open the worm can). I find the GB MCS to be the most secure but least documented. The 3M variety is less secure but does claims this on their documentation:
"The 3M? Cable Stacker SI-1 and 3M? Furring Strip Cable Stacker SIFS-1 are intended for use with NM and UF cables on framing members. SI-1 allows the installation of multiple NM or UF cables on one side of a 2 x 4 in vertical or horizontal raceways."
stackers.jpg

I plan on using quite a few on a 11,000 sq. ft. custom where I know the customer will be changing things daily. Moving cables in these clips is far better IMHO than repeatedly molesting conductors with staples.
I respectfully ask for any inspectors or EC comments.

"Educated far beyond my intelligence"
Bill
 
They are too expensive to use on floor joists. Why not use staples. The only problem I see with the stackers on floor joist is that they may sag since they don't hold well in that position.
 
stackers

stackers

Welcome to the forum!:smile: I have used the cable stackers. Why the concern over "horizontal", I thought they are rated for this? Be concerned with "bundling" of cables.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
They are too expensive to use on floor joists. Why not use staples. The only problem I see with the stackers on floor joist is that they may sag since they don't hold well in that position.
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Dennis, you can always add more to prevent sagging, I generally install them at 32" to prevent this.
 
Agreed, at 30 cents a pop these do add about 6 cents a foot to my cable costs. I just did a glamor bath for this customer, 480 sq. ft. 81 holes, initially $8k went to over $13k with changes.
In any case, between the customer who is the G.C., the wife who is the P.I.A. and the designer who is the I.D.I.O.T., I know there will major changes on a weekly basis using stackers allows me to move things without molesting the NM. The current project is 484 holes (this will go up to over 600), I just like to plan for all contingencies and appreciate any input.

"Educated far beyond my intelligence"
Bill
 
3m

3m

shermansfather said:
Agreed, at 30 cents a pop these do add about 6 cents a foot to my cable costs. I just did a glamor bath for this customer, 480 sq. ft. 81 holes, initially $8k went to over $13k with changes.
In any case, between the customer who is the G.C., the wife who is the P.I.A. and the designer who is the I.D.I.O.T., I know there will major changes on a weekly basis using stackers allows me to move things without molesting the NM. The current project is 484 holes (this will go up to over 600), I just like to plan for all contingencies and appreciate any input.

"Educated far beyond my intelligence"
Bill
Click to expand...
I can't think of any thing cheap that 3m makes , but they have some quality stuff! Do they make a "stud" repair putty!:D :D
 
Just to beat this minutia to death a little more, 3M, GB & Arlington stackers all have a little tab meant to be placed at the surface of the stud - to position itself in compliance with NEC 300-4-(d). If I place stackers horizontally on say a 2" x 12", closer to it's center (5" or 6" up the joist or rafter) might anyone say I'm not using a listed device for it's description.

"Educated far beyond my intelligence"
Bill
 
ItsHot said:
I can't think of any thing cheap that 3m makes , but they have some quality stuff!
Click to expand...

In general, I agree with that comment...however....the 3M duct tape is pure crap.
 
shermansfather said:
Just to beat this minutia to death a little more, 3M, GB & Arlington stackers all have a little tab meant to be placed at the surface of the stud - to position itself in compliance with NEC 300-4-(d). If I place stackers horizontally on say a 2" x 12", closer to it's center (5" or 6" up the joist or rafter) might anyone say I'm not using a listed device for it's description.
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If the tab is there to comply with 300.4(D) ~ why would anyone consider placing the stacker at a different dimension?
 
I'm saying the tab puts the cable back just 1.25" back and away for 2"x4", since I'm working with a joist or a rafter I would prefer to tuck it back a little further. As one might side staple to a joist a few inches up.

"Educated far beyond my intelligence"
Bill
 
I would bet that there isn't any verbiage that's part of the product listing that says it must be installed only at the edge of the framing member.
 
I use "stackers" this way all the time.

In my opinion, the extra cost is more than paid for by the labor savings.

They are especially handy if you use them along a center support beam in a basement.
I make one trip down the beam installing the stackers (usually about 36" centers), and then it's really easy to make the cable pulls and simply snap them into the stackers.
Forget about the hammer and staples until you make the turns out to the floor penetrations.
Nice and neat, with no wire bundling concerns.

I like them a lot for this use.

Just my opinion
steve
 
I love 3M cable stacker's ( no I am not going to marry them ) I buy them by the case and forget about the cost. They are easy on the cable, unlike staples, you can add or move cables if needed. They are great for putting in before running your cables. As far as sagging cables goes add more or put a zip tie on them, the sagging between stacker's just gives cooling space for the cables so they are not considered "bundled":D
 
You should be fine.
I've mutilated them before to use them to run wires underneath ductwork in a 2x2 framed soffit and still keep distance away from the framework. Needed to clip the long part in the back and clip the front edge off too.
 
peter d said:
I do the same....the added cost of the stackers is more than saved in all the time it takes to staple multiple runs of cable.
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Speak for yourself. :) They definitely wouldn't save me any time and would take longer for me. So for me I choose to not use them except for when I have to on a 2 x 4 with too many wires to use staples.
 
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