V Phase Voltage Issues

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suco

Member
Location
Kansas
Hey all,

I work for a small rural electric cooperative (4400 meters) with basically no technology. I'm a recent EE grad and am trying to apply what I've learned, and sometimes it's paid off. However, I've learned experience is almost more important than an education.

We're having voltage issues on a 3-phase feeder, particularly where a V-phase tap extends 6.5 miles off and feeds 5 irrigation services. This area of our system is pretty low density (system average is 2 meters/mile). The operations manager has had 2 different sets of capacitor banks installed: One set of (3) 50 kVAR on the mile of 3-phase preceding the V-phase tap, and a set of (2) 100 kVAR 2 miles beyond the 3-phase/V-phase junction.

This V-phase tap also serves some houses. During the winter, the capacitors are taken off line because the cause an over voltage to the houses near the irrigation, as well as a horrible power factor(leading). During the summer months, the capacitors must be online to compensate for the large inductive irrigation loads, otherwise voltage won't be sufficient to start the wells. Another large issue we face with this is rain during the summer: Irrigations don't run and the typical residential cooling load is virtually gone, causing over voltage. Until the heat is back and the fields have dried.

We've gone through 3 different scenarios that might help.

1. Rebuild the V-phase line, upgrading the wire size and adding the 3rd phase to help with the large irrigation loads. Won't we still need the capacitors to offset the large inductive loads, despite the anticipated help balancing voltage with the 3rd phase? This is a sizable rebuild and will cost $200,000+.

2. Install voltage regulators on the V-phase line. I think I'm leaning toward this solution; much lower cost as well.

3. Automate the capacitors. The cost involved with this is too great. Especially considering the load on this substation. As I type this the total substation load is only 350 kW and it peaks at 500 kW.

Am I missing something super obvious? A portion of the V-phase line will be rebuilt for a nearby city's water well service, but that's not happening for a while.

Thanks for the advice.
 

Julius Right

Senior Member
Occupation
Electrical Engineer Power Station Physical Design Retired
In my opinion, V-Phase [ VX1 or VX5]device is single-phase, then you need 3 per position.
Second, maximum current has to be 100 [limited-minutes-duration] but 32 A continuously.
I don't know how the well pump positions are and what the required power of each one is. However, it seems to me the voltage drop could reach 45%. I don't know how V-Phase device could rise the voltage from 45% drop[127 V instead of 230] since I understood the limits has to be 207 to 253 V in order to supply 220 V.
In my opinion, for this distance [6.5 miles=10.5 km] you need a 11 kV overhead line connected with suitable transformers[step-up and step-down].:weeping:
See[for information]:
http://www.allsolutionsroma.it/prodotti/pdf_tecnici/818.pdf
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
Take the approach the rural POCO's around here have taken - customer now has to provide power factor correction on any individual motor over 40 hp or will have penalties to pay.

This started out one year as a requirement for all new installs, and eventually eased into requiring addition of existing installs.

When customers ask about what it is and why they have to do it, I explain it is something the POCO has taken care of in the past, now they are just putting the burden more directly on the users that create the issue and it helps them keep costs for all users down.
 

suco

Member
Location
Kansas
In my opinion, V-Phase [ VX1 or VX5]device is single-phase, then you need 3 per position.
Second, maximum current has to be 100 [limited-minutes-duration] but 32 A continuously.
I don't know how the well pump positions are and what the required power of each one is. However, it seems to me the voltage drop could reach 45%. I don't know how V-Phase device could rise the voltage from 45% drop[127 V instead of 230] since I understood the limits has to be 207 to 253 V in order to supply 220 V.
In my opinion, for this distance [6.5 miles=10.5 km] you need a 11 kV overhead line connected with suitable transformers[step-up and step-down].:weeping:
See[for information]:
http://www.allsolutionsroma.it/prodotti/pdf_tecnici/818.pdf

Sorry, by V-phase, I meant a 2-phase distribution system being used for 3-phase loads by open-delta 480V banks. This is a 12,470 V overhead distribution line.

Basic info
voltage
Total motor hp

option 2 is more expensive than 3 isn't it?
I might look at 3, there are packages to do it
http://m.sandc.com/?url=http://www....ol/automatic-capacitor-controls.asp&width=412

This may work. Thanks!

Take the approach the rural POCO's around here have taken - customer now has to provide power factor correction on any individual motor over 40 hp or will have penalties to pay.

This started out one year as a requirement for all new installs, and eventually eased into requiring addition of existing installs.

When customers ask about what it is and why they have to do it, I explain it is something the POCO has taken care of in the past, now they are just putting the burden more directly on the users that create the issue and it helps them keep costs for all users down.

That is one route. However, that may hurt our farmers operations... the board may not approve.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
Sorry, by V-phase, I meant a 2-phase distribution system being used for 3-phase loads by open-delta 480V banks. This is a 12,470 V overhead distribution line.



This may work. Thanks!



That is one route. However, that may hurt our farmers operations... the board may not approve.
You have to ease them into it. Start out just requiring correction on new installations, then after maybe 5 years start requiring more existing conditions to be converted or else pay a penalty. Of course you then need to somehow monitor power factor at customer level, but depending on what metering you use that may not be that difficult.

I realize that may not be an immediate fix for a particular location that you maybe having troubles with but still something to consider.
 
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