Warning ribbon

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george t. everett

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New York
In the question & answer section of a recent EC&M magazine, a question was asked, is
a warning ribbon required for underground service conductors, if installed in a raceway?
Mike's answer was no, only direct buried service lateral conductors, in accordance with the requirements of 300.5D. I looked at 300.5D and don't read that, what am I missing?
 
300.5(D) tells us that it only applies to direct-buried conductors
and cables, if they are in a raceway they are not direct buried.


300.5 Underground Installations

(D) Protection from Damage. Direct-buried conductors
and cables shall be protected from damage in accordance
with 300.5(D)(1) through (D)(4).


(3) Service Conductors. Underground service conductors
that are not encased in concrete and that are buried 450 mm
(18 in.) or more below grade shall have their location identified
by a warning ribbon that is placed in the trench at
least 300 mm (12 in.) above the underground installation.
Click to expand...
 
I used to say the ribbon was required for conduit systems also, but I have been convinced that the correct answer would be "no". It probably could be read either way but the argument presented to me is:
When 300.5(D) discusses the conductors it mentions where they shall be in conduit, etc which seems to indicate they are only talking about the conductors, not the raceway. 300(D)(3) refers to "conductors", not to conduits.
When reading the comments in the Handbook, however, it seems to indicate any time the conductoirs are not encased in concrete.
 
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I agree not required by the NEC for conduit, but it is possible that it could be a POCO requirement anyway.
 
george t. everett said:
In the question & answer section of a recent EC&M magazine, a question was asked, is
a warning ribbon required for underground service conductors, if installed in a raceway?
Mike's answer was no, only direct buried service lateral conductors, in accordance with the requirements of 300.5D. I looked at 300.5D and don't read that, what am I missing?
Click to expand...


Well i agree with the results of iwires post but i do not understand why the code does not include conduits IMO i think it should be a rule on every project mostly due to the damage and cost that contractors go thur to repair broken conduits .

And the safety factor when one hits a live duct bank .
 
iwire said:
You need to talk to your billing people, where I am we charge money to repair broken conduits. :cool:
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Well my company gets paid you can bet on that ! But it just makes common sense to put warning tape on top it may not be in the code but it should be .
Its normally in our specs on every job so we do it .

We have installed it and it helps greatly the cost of tape is a lot less than new feeders conduit and people but dont put it in if its not in the code .

I dont agree with the reason just the rule meaning conduit is protection maybe on general jobs not on our jobs.

Digging takes on a whole new meaning on some job sites .
 
Around here the poco wants it for all buried services, conduit or not. They require the type that when pinged by their toner puts out a signal that is different than the tape for other utlilities. Not sure about how that works.
 
ohmhead said:
I dont agree with the reason just the rule meaning conduit is protection maybe on general jobs not on our jobs.

Digging takes on a whole new meaning on some job sites .
Click to expand...

I know, you work large jobs. :roll:

Don't you think the warning ribbon has more to do with protecting people who are hand digging more than protecting a conduit from a large excavator?

The NEC is about protecting people not protecting conduits.

If you want to install a ribbon go for it, I just do not see a reason the NEC should require one.:)
 
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