Weird Generator arrangement

[RD35]

Homeowner has a 400A 120/240V 1-phase service at his house. House panel is 200A. Shop (100 feet away) has 200A panel fed underground from the house. Each panel is fed from separate service CB Enclosures adjacent to the 400A meter base at the house. The homeowner wants to use a portable generator to feed two 200A whole-house manual transfer switches..one at the house and one at the shop...each next to their respective loadcenters. He wants this portable generator located out at the shop building. Portable has a 2P60A breaker on it. He wants to install (bury) a 60A feeder along side the 200A shop building feeder so he can feed power from the shop to the house manual transfer switch. He will also have some switch leg wires in the ditch as well for controlling lights from either building via a circuit originating in the shop. Is there a code violation hidden in this design somewhere?

Now....the thought plickens….He also wants to install additional u/g conduits so that he can (in the future) install a stationary automatic generator and two automatic 200A whole-house transfer switches adjacent to the two service disconnects at the house. These switches will feed the utility terminals of each of his manual transfer switch. So...yes....this guy will have (4) 200A transfer switches...2 auto and 2 manual. Do you all see anything alarming (code wise) about this design. I cannot find any violations so far....but it's so complicated I thought I'd post it up and see if any of you can spot a problem I am not seeing. Thanks

 

[RD35]

Hey folks I tried posting the attachment and it was so blurry I decided to remove it and just describe the potential situation. I guess the attachment did not delete. Sorry.

 

[jap]

It looks to me like the owner has an electrical conglomeration that needs a house added to it.

JAP>

 

[Hv&Lv]

Hey folks I tried posting the attachment and it was so blurry I decided to remove it and just describe the potential situation. I guess the attachment did not delete. Sorry.

I’m glad it didn’t delete...
i would hate to try to read a description of what is drawn there. My mind couldn’t grasp it..:dunce:

 

[ActionDave]

Hey folks I tried posting the attachment and it was so blurry I decided to remove it and just describe the potential situation. I guess the attachment did not delete. Sorry.

Let's break this down a little bit.

If I understand correctly your guy wants to be able to feed his house and his shop, at the same time, from a portable generator or a permanently installed generator. True?

 

[mbrooke]

It looks to me like the owner has an electrical conglomeration that needs a house added to it.

JAP>

I'm guilty of doing the same to my house. When you are an electrical enthusiast your imagination runs wild with all what ifs.

 

[mbrooke]

Homeowner has a 400A 120/240V 1-phase service at his house. House panel is 200A. Shop (100 feet away) has 200A panel fed underground from the house. Each panel is fed from separate service CB Enclosures adjacent to the 400A meter base at the house. The homeowner wants to use a portable generator to feed two 200A whole-house manual transfer switches..one at the house and one at the shop...each next to their respective loadcenters. He wants this portable generator located out at the shop building. Portable has a 2P60A breaker on it. He wants to install (bury) a 60A feeder along side the 200A shop building feeder so he can feed power from the shop to the house manual transfer switch. He will also have some switch leg wires in the ditch as well for controlling lights from either building via a circuit originating in the shop. Is there a code violation hidden in this design somewhere?

Now....the thought plickens….He also wants to install additional u/g conduits so that he can (in the future) install a stationary automatic generator and two automatic 200A whole-house transfer switches adjacent to the two service disconnects at the house. These switches will feed the utility terminals of each of his manual transfer switch. So...yes....this guy will have (4) 200A transfer switches...2 auto and 2 manual. Do you all see anything alarming (code wise) about this design. I cannot find any violations so far....but it's so complicated I thought I'd post it up and see if any of you can spot a problem I am not seeing. Thanks

At is stands, I don't see any code violations, but I'd have to look at this a bit more.

BTW, what will the NEMA 14-30r receptacle in the living room be used for?

 

[RD35]

ActionDave - yes, he wants to install the manual switches now and leave space on the wall to add the automatic switches later. This way he can utilize the two switches he already owns and he can power the house with his 16KW portable generator or his smaller 5KW portable....or both at the same time if he wants to. Later on, he wants to install the Stationary Automatic system while retaining the capability to use the portable(s) in the event the automatic unit should fail or run out of LP Gas.

Hey mbrooke thanks for the question about the receptacle! It caused me to take another look at my poor artwork (yes, I drew a 14-30R...off the top of my head without checking my work). My intention was to draw a 14-60 receptacle. However, this also caused to me to check....and what I found is the homeowners 16kw generator actually has multiple outlets....the largest of which is a 14-50. So, the receptacle that is "in the house" is actually in the attached garage (not the living room ) and will be a 14-50. The homeowner will be able to run the shop and the house on separate generators....or he can run both the shop and house from one portable at the shop. I guess it's like a guy owning 50 guns! Does he really need them.....no! But does he enjoy owning them and having them! Yes! I think this homeowner is similar as he wants to have the most flexibility possible by using both of his manual switches and one or both of his portables.