What’s wrong

tom baker

tom baker

First Chief Moderator & NEC Expert
Staff member
Location
Bremerton, Washington
Occupation
Master Electrician
This picture was in the WA State Currents newsletter picture of the month. Taken by an inspector, the question is asked what article 230 section is the installation a violation of?
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That’s what I saw. Expensive mistake.
And some type of CT enclosure on left.
If POCO does not allow then it’s really expensive
 
Only 2 grounded conductor and EGC connections in left section?
No GES?
 
Funny, there are only 6 disconnects being used. Even with 7 we would have to know what they are serving 230.2(A) & 230.72(B) to actually know if there's a problem.
 
Shooting from the hip: do the neutral need to be identified with their appropriate hot conductors, or is that only for feeders and branches?
 
electrofelon said:
But cant you only have a Max of six grouped in one location?
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Yes six is the maximum per service unless additional disconnects meet the exception like for a fire pump. You could have 10 services with 60 disconnects in one location.
 
infinity said:
Yes six is the maximum per service unless additional disconnects meet the exception like for a fire pump. You could have 10 services with 60 disconnects in one location.
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but 230.72(B) says:

(B) Additional Service Disconnecting Means. The one or more additional service disconnecting means for fire pumps, emergency systems, legally required standby, or optional standby services permitted by 230.2 shall be installed remote from the one to six service disconnecting means for normal service to minimize the possibility of simultaneous interruption of supply.

and

230.71 Maximum Number of Disconnects. (A) General. The service disconnecting means for each serv‐ ice permitted by 230.2, or for each set of service-entrance conductors permitted by 230.40, Exception No. 1, 3, 4, or 5, shall consist of not more than six switches or sets of circuit breakers, or a combination of not more than six switches and sets of circuit breakers, mounted in a single enclosure, in a group of separate enclosures, or in or on a switchboard or in switchgear. There shall be not more than six sets of disconnects per service grouped in any one location

Now I understand the second reference says "per service" so that doesnt disallow disconnects from different services to be grouped and exceed 6, but the first reference IS talking about different services and says they must be remote. So am I correct that there would have to be 2 services and they must be "normal" loads to have more than 6 grouped in one location? Clearly the OP is one service.
 
tom baker said:
If POCO does not allow then it’s really expensive
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If Poco seals service wire side, & prohibits taps from there, then are customer side meter-pack taps a listing violation?

Have always refused clients trying to tap meter packs for house meters, regarless if <=6 DC’s.
 
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Please excuse my ignorance as this is a little above my pay grade, as I don’t do new multi-family, but suppose you had a 20 unit condo complex, 1 structure, or a 50 unit apartment complex, and each had to be separately metered, how would that be done, if each structure is only allowed 1 service, and no more than 6 disconnects?

Would there have to be a main disconnect ahead of the meter stacks, and how would that work with the POCO?
 
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