what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

Status
Not open for further replies.
M

Matt Harp

Member
I had to change a meter base from a 200A base to a 200A "bypass" meter base. AHJ told me " code does not require a bypass base, so I do not require a bypass base." He then put a preety green pass sticker on my install. The POCO then refused to hook up because " we require any service 100A or more, single or 3-phase, to have a bypass meter base so that we can pull the meter without cutting the building's power." I changed it, got it re-inspected (the AHJ was real good about it and didn't charge me an extra fee but did bash the POCO quite a bit), and ate the cost.

What do you do?
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

This is not an NEC issue it is a poco requirement. You had no choice. Let this be a lesson learned for next time.
Many pocos have a spec book that spells out there requirements for service. Most also offer the same info online.

By the way the inspector should have known this and could have given you a heads up.
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

The inspector did know this. I found that out on the re-inspect. And try to get a spec sheet out of Salt River Electric. I finally did and don't recall seeing ANYTHING about bypass bases.

I'll see if I still have the spec sheet.
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

You are describing a common situation. Here in MA, you'd have to follow poco requirements as well as being compliant w/ Mass code. Another example is 3' clearance from windows which open. NEC/ MEC requires 3' clearance from openings for service conductors installed as open conductors with the exception of those above windows. Local poco requires 3' clearance without exception, so more stringent rule applies as stated in the poco requirements. AHJ may approve installation and poco will refuse service.
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

Oh, and Scott. My father used to say that. I always hated it when he said that. lol
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

Matt, I have learned my share of "lessons", some the hard way. :(
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

Originally posted by electricmanscott:

By the way the inspector should have known this and could have given you a heads up.
Click to expand...
Scott, this is not the inspectors duty to supply information that is made public, it is the contractors duty to obtain the information. Not trying to sound harsh, but that is fact. :cool:


I learned my lesson too:


I once tried to tell the head electrician and the GC that the poco was going to flag their services, but I passed them anyway. A month later, we had new permits for new services being built on the job. When I showed up, I was blamed for passing them, knowing the poco was going to flag them. How ironic.
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

Originally posted by throttlebody:
Scott, this is not the inspectors duty to supply information that is made public, it is the contractors duty to obtain the information. Not trying to sound harsh, but that is fact.
Click to expand...
This would be common courtesy. To not say something would make the inspector look like a real ahole in my eyes.

Not saying the inspector must but come on. In this case the inspector knew and kept his mouth shut. :roll:

[ February 17, 2006, 06:49 AM: Message edited by: electricmanscott ]
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

from an inspectors standpoint, I have been bitten more than once by saying "POCO won't accept that" and later find there was a POCO buddy involved and "this time" POCO allowed it. In our particular jurisdiction, I enforce NEC and State code rules. If the job passes them, its accepted. If I see something that doesn't meet POCO standards I try to inform the contractor, as he should have done in your case, and I inform POCO so they can make a decision on enforcement of their rules.
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

I once had a similar situation. There was a 200 amp panel and a 100 amp panel that needed service. 4/0 and #2 SE out the wall for meter. 4/0 and #2 up mast for connection. Now any dummy knows the #2 will be overloaded being paralleled with the 4/0. AHJ passed it POCO would not hook up. When I got there and saw it I could only laugh, guess they were just weren't thinking.
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

Originally posted by Paul B:
I once had a similar situation. There was a 200 amp panel and a 100 amp panel that needed service. 4/0 and #2 SE out the wall for meter. 4/0 and #2 up mast for connection. Now any dummy knows the #2 will be overloaded being paralleled with the 4/0. AHJ passed it POCO would not hook up. When I got there and saw it I could only laugh, guess they were just weren't thinking.
Click to expand...
Where the two service drops connected to separate panels? That is, the #2 went to the 100 amp panel and the 4/0 to the 200 amp panel? In that case, there would be no overloading as the two cable are not in parallel.
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

Yes, he said 2 different panels and ratings. I never knew the lesser had to be sized to the larger separate service disconnect.
pic.php


[ February 17, 2006, 05:46 PM: Message edited by: throttlebody ]
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

Here is my opinion as I stated it to the inspector and the POCO.
The AHJ should be the AHJ. If the POCO wants to dictate install requirements then they should convince the Municipality to make them the AHJ.
If that municipality wants government employed inspectors to be the AHJ, then the gov't. needs to put the POCO in its place.
Personally, I do not believe most POCO employees have the skills to properly evaluate NEC governed installs, just as it would be unwise to have most industrial, commercial, or residential electricians install or evaluate utility transmission or distribution systems. Neither side has the experience to deal with the quirks of the other's work.
 
Re: what do you do when the AHJ and POCO disagree?

Matt,

The bottom line is that you must follow the utilities rules. Consider it a lesson learned.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top