Where did the neutral go?

[bonding jumper]

I'm confused, the building I am renovating had this situation. An incomming set of 4 2/0 conductors goes through a dis switch, then a meter than a pull box. The pull box splits the 2/0 conductor to serve a disconnect switch and three panels. Each of the 2/0 conductors is spliced with 3 #2 conductors. I can't find what happened to the neutral in this mess. I see calcium deposits all over the conduits where they tie in to the panels and disc switches. Please ask me some questions and I'll answer them to the best of my ability.

(smaller photos compliments of Dave Nix > websparky)

[ September 10, 2003, 06:03 PM: Message edited by: bill addiss ]

 

[flightline]

Re: Where did the neutral go?

Perhaps I have no place saying this, given my goof, but you'll need to resize your image files. I got some great advice from the forum members, so look [ here to give you some information on how to do so. Good Luck! Gregg

[ September 10, 2003, 03:07 PM: Message edited by: flightline ]

 

[brian john]

Re: Where did the neutral go?

Questions in order of importance:

1. Why haven't you nuked this site.
2. Refer to question one.

 

[Guest]

Re: Where did the neutral go?

Your image
is 2048 wide
by 1536 pixels high.
Please resize to
about
400 pixels wide
by about 300 pixels
high.

It will still
be big enough.

../Wayne

PS: I think you
set a record for
image size posted
on a user forum. I
included a "hard"
Enter on each line
of my post so you
can read my post
without
s---c---r---o---l---l---i---n---g

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Re: Where did the neutral go?

bonding jumper,
What type of loads are supplied from these panels?
Are they 3 phase or single phase? What is the voltage?
Don

 

[cm]

Re: Where did the neutral go?

Be careful do not remove any locknuts or panels without disconnecting service feeders at there point of attachment, and amprobeing the neutral and gec first the conduit has more surface area than the neutral conductor its probably being used for the neutral look for locknuts glowing orange.looks like the bonding screw or straps makeing the connection.

 

[big john]

Re: Where did the neutral go?

Mind you, I'm just an apprentice so there's a lot I haven't seen: But in the second picture you posted of that 3/P disco. (aside from the obviously ratty termination job) that can't possibly be designed to be wired like that... can it? Shouldn't the load be piped down the outside and enter through the bottom of that disconnect?

Thanks.
-John

 

[goldstar]

Re: Where did the neutral go?

Looks like a 3 phase ungrounded system. I ran into a similar situation at a facility in Newark, NJ several years ago. Using a multi-meter see if you can measure voltage between any of the phase conductors and the cabinet. If not, then it's a 3-phase ungrounded system. You can ask your POCO to come out and verify. I had to replace the conduit, conductors and meter pan for the entire service. The POCO had me install a single phase, 200 amp meter pan with the ground jumper removed from the 5th jaw. With that jumper removed the 5th jaw terminal was insulated from the enclosure, that conductor ran directly through to the disconnect and the meter was able to measure the current.

Also, seeing as how this is another one of those high quality installations and I don't see any orange tape, I would make sure you don't have a high leg.

 

[bonding jumper]

Re: Where did the neutral go?

I measured it to be 3 phase, 208. U can see there is no neutral in the disconnect switch, All the subpanels are 3 phase, I can't find the actual Neutral in the subpanels, all the wires are regular number 12 that connect to the bus. And i did measure between the legs and the casing of the switch, and i would get 120 every time.
This is a restaruant that had been exposed to fire, the fire only happened in the kitchen and all associated wiring in the kitchen is going to be replaced, all I am responsible for is a #2 wire that feeds the panel in the kitchen, but I am confused about the neutral. Largest loads are refridgerators, one walk in, that is fed from the top of that disconnect switch, to another disc. switch closer to the unit.
Also, thanx for fixing the pictures.

[ September 11, 2003, 01:48 PM: Message edited by: bonding jumper ]

 

[Guest]

Re: Where did the neutral go?

Also, thanx for fixing the pictures.

Not to belabor the point, but IMHO the images are still too big. The best policy when posting images online is to make them as SMALL as possible and still get your point across. These images could be a lot smaller and still work. For example for those running 800x600 resolution, with a few toolbars on their web browser, the images still fill more than one screen. There are three images and on my monitor they fill FIVE SCREENS! All the images could be resized down so that they could be viewed side-by-side and on one small screen.

The other way to do it if you must post huge pictures is to post thumbnails that show the gist of your picture, and then provide a link to the bigger images.

Sorry to perserverate on this, but right now my monitor is small and my resolution is low. I'm still waiting for my replacement monitor to arrive from the factory. I am trying to help you. Somewhat off-topic, but still helpful for this forum.

../Wayne

Here is an example of an image that is only 162 by 162 pixels and is only 11K:

Image property of: http://www.hammerzone.com

[ September 11, 2003, 02:12 PM: Message edited by: awwt ]