Who's responsible???

[SPARKS40]

Got a call today from a buddy who maintains an apartment complex. Turns out, there was a tenant who had her meter pulled by the POCO for delinquency. When the POCO attempted to replace the meter in the socket, there was arcing and smoke. I'm leaving in a few to go over and assess the problem, but my question is who would be ultimately responsible for the damages?? I'm thinking the POCO......thoughts or suggestions?? Also, the meters are inside the structure now, so should i assume this falls under reapair work and mount the new socket inside, or does everything need to come out now???

 

[480sparky]

Only the meter belongs to the POCO. The socket is the owners problem.
As for whether or not you need to install a new service with the socket outside is a local & POCO rule, not an NEC one.

 

[mikeames]

we had a job with the same exact problem where the POCO broke the pastic mount holding the meter jaws in place. It was a multi stack meter so replacing it would be a big job. The poco would not power up until it was fixed even though they broke it. we would up getting a new plastic mount after a long search.

 

[active1]

I recomend staying out of deciding who is at fault. If the building owner wants it repaired make sure they understand they are responceable for the bill. If the customer has the impression that it is the POCO's fault this will not get resolved anytime soon. It will turn into a stale mate. When the building owner wants power restored they will make the repair. The trouble is you'll end up waisting phone time, service trips, and by the time you need the POCO to return the power after the repair they will be hard to be find.

The meter housing is the customers responsability.

 

[mivey]

There is probably no fault to be assigned as the equipment just failed: the customer is responsible for maintaining the equipment and will have to get it repaired/replaced.

If you could prove the POCO damaged the customer's equipment through some abnormal/negligent type action, then the POCO would be at fault and responsible. This is a probability, but a very small one as these guys are as familiar with this work as you are with brushing your teeth. Even so, the gums occasionally get stabbed with the brush.

Proving they are at fault would be a very tough nut to crack. Besides, these guys have nothing to gain by hiding anything. The company insurance will cover any damages they could not fix themselves. The POCOs in my area do not abuse the employees for accidents as they do happen and any accident prone employee would eventually be sent packing.

 

[ultramegabob]

I would just let the owner know before you start, that if they want you to fix it they are to pay you directly. If they feel they deserve to be compensated, they can take your bill to the Poco and work it out with them.

 

[GUNNING]

Good advice. Get paid dont advocate.

 

[mivey]

I recomend staying out of deciding who is at fault. If the building owner wants it repaired make sure they understand they are responceable for the bill. If the customer has the impression that it is the POCO's fault this will not get resolved anytime soon. It will turn into a stale mate. When the building owner wants power restored they will make the repair. The trouble is you'll end up waisting phone time, service trips, and by the time you need the POCO to return the power after the repair they will be hard to be find.

The meter housing is the customers responsability.

Good advice on the repair payment. But you should charge for the consultation time, not waste it. If the owner wants to pay me to stay on the phone all day in an air conditioned room, ride around in my air conditioned truck, track down the POCO, and help gather evidence to use to try to prove the POCO is responsible: it beats ditch digging.

 

[GUNNING]

"help gather evidence to use to try to prove the POCO is responsible"


Only if its in your job definition. It will only alienate the POCO and the customer will bad mouth you for not getting the POCO to pay. Which will result in you not getting paid. How do you "prove" you were ridding around getting evidence? How do you "prove" its the POCO's fault? Not by driving around. Get the job done. If you feel obligated to make a note put it on the invoice of repair and let the inspector take the hit for answering to the talking heads. Keep within your job definition. Let the lawyers handle this one. Around here we have linemen trying to make judgmental appraisals as to who is at fault. Never see them anymore.

 

[SPARKS40]

Well......got it goin' on now....I replaced the meter socket (indoors at that), POCO calls AHJ, complaining that permit wasn't pulled, and repair/replacement was not authorized by owner (funny, owner is who called me)......i guess "fix it" just doesn't get it anymore........

 

[charlietuna]

You know you need a permit! You will deal with the inspector for the rest of your career and the power company even longer. The chances of your buddy's meter socket failing again is very small. Maintain a good relationship with the inspector and power company and let your buddy go after them--don't get involved.

 

[mivey]

"help gather evidence to use to try to prove the POCO is responsible"


Only if its in your job definition. It will only alienate the POCO and the customer will bad mouth you for not getting the POCO to pay. Which will result in you not getting paid. How do you "prove" you were ridding around getting evidence? How do you "prove" its the POCO's fault? Not by driving around. Get the job done. If you feel obligated to make a note put it on the invoice of repair and let the inspector take the hit for answering to the talking heads. Keep within your job definition. Let the lawyers handle this one. Around here we have linemen trying to make judgmental appraisals as to who is at fault. Never see them anymore.

You can alienate by making up stuff. Not what I was advocating at all. I have never alienated a POCO.

If a customer pays for investigative work, I'll do it. If they want to pay me to sweep the floor, I'll do it. Handle your job like a professional and the other professionals won't be offended.

Would you get mad at another electrician that was hired to check behind your work? If they acted unprofessionally, maybe. If they were professional, why would you? It is what they were hired to do. There may be a difference of opinion on some things, but you should be able to support your opinion the same as anyone else.

It doesn't have to be personal, although it can get that way sometimes.

 

[growler]

Well......got it goin' on now....I replaced the meter socket (indoors at that), POCO calls AHJ, complaining that permit wasn't pulled, and repair/replacement was not authorized by owner (funny, owner is who called me)......i guess "fix it" just doesn't get it anymore........

One thing to remember about the power company (POCO) is that they are licenced as a utility. By having the utility company licensed they are in the same boat we are and they can not do whatever they want, they also have to follow rules.

The power company has to cover themselves the same way we have to cover ourselves to avoid liability. This is why they want permits and some times authorization forms signed. They are not really allowed to hook up to a service that's not been approved.

 

[SPARKS40]

UPDATE.......AHJ conceded to the fact that arcin & sparkin in the meter socket was a direct result of the POCO removing the meter in the first place, and that i was in the right with replacing the defective meter socket where it stood.....called it an emergency repair.....meter's back in place, and all is good......:grin:

 

[fondini]

poco

poco

didnt poco shut the load down before sticking meter?

 

[SPARKS40]

didnt poco shut the load down before sticking meter?

POCO both pulls and re-installs meters under load here. The one time i asked, i was told there were no worries. (Let me get to the truck first)