Twoskinsoneman
Senior Member
- Location
- West Virginia, USA NEC: 2020
- Occupation
- Facility Senior Electrician
I have repaired lots of underground, almost always is an ungrounded conductor that I have repaired unless someone physically did some damage, like with excavating equipment or driving a post or similar item into it.That kinda brings up another can of worms, why do the neutral on buried cables fail way more than the hots? Maybe pinhole lightning damage? Water intrusion because of that? There should be very little, if no voltage leakage because it’s at the relatively same potential as earth.
I’ve had the opposite experience, almost always the grounded conductor in direct burial cable. Now in conduit, it’s always the ungrounded conductor.I have repaired lots of underground, almost always is an ungrounded conductor that I have repaired unless someone physically did some damage, like with excavating equipment or driving a post or similar item into it.
Occasionally have had a failing ungrounded conductor cause heat damage to insulation on adjacent conductors though. Had one of those just a couple weeks ago.
Copper, aluminum, either?I’ve had the opposite experience, almost always the grounded conductor in direct burial cable. Now in conduit, it’s always the ungrounded conductor.
Yeah. I was hoping the cord could be salvaged. I cut back a foot, then 5 feet. After deciding to junk it I even cut into near mid way out of curiosity. IMHO the grounded conductor looks overheated throughout.By any chance did you strip the white insulation back at least an inch and inspect that area. During my 50 enjoyable years as a commercial electrician have found copper cord strands discolored. Only time they were burnt was at a poor connection on a device. Recently converted one of my 4' garage luminares to LED. When I removed the ballast cut back the quality yellow 16/3 Bronco cord that I installed over 45 years ago. Was going to replace it but copper strands were still bright and insulation pliable so did not replace the cord. Color on cheap SJO ( believe only rated for 300 volts) copper strands were often discolored entire length on installs maybe over 10 years.
Perhaps. I've never seen new cord with one conductor that looks like that but I haven't seen it all. I do feel like I can tell when copper has been overheated. Beside the blackening and duller color you can see in the pic, when I fan out the individual strands and flatten it, it has the darker red color that's always indicated to me excessive heat.In a two wire circuits there is no reason why one conductor should be different than the other from use. My guess is that they're not burnt they were just manufactured that way with discolored strands.
Yeah, same here. I've heard some explanations from guys who have also noticed it happens with the grounded conductor much more often but nothing plausible.90% of burnt receptacles that I find, the neutral is the one burnt. I don't have a reason for it, maybe luck of the draw!
Just a wild guess but wonder if the coloring agent or dye they use to produce white insulation has an effect on the copper. Black insulation might use common lamp black to produce that color. According to a Google search lamp black is very stable & unaffected by light, acids & alkaloids.Yeah. I was hoping the cord could be salvaged. I cut back a foot, then 5 feet. After deciding to junk it I even cut into near mid way out of curiosity. IMHO the grounded conductor looks overheated throughout.
"looks overheated" is the point.Yeah. I was hoping the cord could be salvaged. I cut back a foot, then 5 feet. After deciding to junk it I even cut into near mid way out of curiosity. IMHO the grounded conductor looks overheated throughout.
Or maybe the white insulation melts at a lower temp.Just a wild guess but wonder if the coloring agent or dye they use to produce white insulation has an effect on the copper. Black insulation might use common lamp black to produce that color. According to a Google search lamp black is very stable & unaffected by light, acids & alkaloids.
But that only affects multiwire circuits. Thats why you find an oversized neutral on office furniture.Could just be nonlinear loads and excess heating from harmonics, though that is just a stab in the dark.
Could just be nonlinear loads and excess heating from harmonics, though that is just a stab in the dark.
And mostly only the neutral on systems supplied from a wye secondary.But that only affects multiwire circuits. Thats why you find an oversized neutral on office furniture.