rate work

Status
Not open for further replies.

liquidtite

Senior Member
Location
Ny
I wasn't working under a collective bargaining agreement nor was I working within a state indentured apprenticeship program. Also I no longer work for this employer as of last month. The fact that he doesn't put down the pw wage and put down my reg wage with bumped up hrs. wouldn't be a red flag? Is he in violation for doing this?
 

Rewire

Senior Member
I wasn't working under a collective bargaining agreement nor was I working within a state indentured apprenticeship program. Also I no longer work for this employer as of last month. The fact that he doesn't put down the pw wage and put down my reg wage with bumped up hrs. wouldn't be a red flag? Is he in violation for doing this?

what ever he has done to your hours and pay you can be sure it was not for your benefit. Call your state labor relations board and tell them your story and go with what they tell you if you are owed money it should be payed to you.
 

Fulthrotl

~Autocorrect is My Worst Enema.~
I wasn't working under a collective bargaining agreement nor was I working within a state indentured apprenticeship program. Also I no longer work for this employer as of last month. The fact that he doesn't put down the pw wage and put down my reg wage with bumped up hrs. wouldn't be a red flag? Is he in violation for doing this?

if you don't screw this up, you have been dealt a windfall.

the job is a certified payroll, if it's a PW job.
certified payroll is like almost like a bonded financial instrument.

it has to be correct with respect to hours. so whatever
he's done, he has reported your YTD hours this way:



guess what?

if the PW is what has been posted here, your gross before
taxes shall be:

98.13 x 194.30 = 19,066.65
147.19 x 16.00 = 2,355.12

total ytd = $21,421.77
less amt. paid - $11,200.00

amount owed you: $10,221.77

better get a claim filed immediately.
these things tend to disappear with time.

understand, you will get this on one check, with witholding
based on a weekly deduction. expect about $4,500.

but, you can expect a good refund at tax time.
 
Last edited:

liquidtite

Senior Member
Location
Ny
Thanks for your guys help I will be making a call today .is that the wage for NYC pw of an apprentice .i didn't know it was that high I have alot more checks than the ones posted
 

liquidtite

Senior Member
Location
Ny
ya u guys said bc I'm not In an apprentice program id be geting jman wages I'm making a call today thanks for your help
 

Daja7

Senior Member
Most if not all fed gov work is pw. If you are or were not registered in a recognized appreticeship program you must be paid same as JW pw. If he is doing this to you he is doing it to others.
Must be reported.
 

MJW

Senior Member
It almost looks like his boss was increasing the number of hours instead of the pay rate to make his gross pay total up to what it should (assuming he is not paying jw rate) when he is making pw. I'm not sure why he would do this unless his accounting program would not allow multiple pay scales and he was on pw and non pw jobs the same pay period. Very confusing.
 

GoldDigger

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Placerville, CA, USA
Occupation
Retired PV System Designer
It almost looks like his boss was increasing the number of hours instead of the pay rate to make his gross pay total up to what it should (assuming he is not paying jw rate) when he is making pw. I'm not sure why he would do this unless his accounting program would not allow multiple pay scales and he was on pw and non pw jobs the same pay period. Very confusing.

Or, as someone speculated, the rate should have been higher and the number of hours reduced to show the PW hourly rate but fewer than actual hours, and the clerk got it backwards.
Or else the contractor was actually fraudulently increasing the payroll on the books and keeping the extra money.
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
Thanks for your guys help I will be making a call today .is that the wage for NYC pw of an apprentice .i didn't know it was that high I have alot more checks than the ones posted


A first year apprentice makes about $12/hr + benefits in NYC.
 

liquidtite

Senior Member
Location
Ny
does anyone know what the provalling wage rate is for an apprentice in nyc and Bronx, .Also if t onlyheirs only two guys on job does the apprentice get journeyman wages?I ask bc my paychecks dont seem to add up and my boss does our paychecks so its hard to see what you make,instead of putting down how much you make hourly of pw he puts down how many hours you would have if it was non rate.When I asked the bosses brother he said that the reason why my check might seem shy is bc he can deduct what it cost to inshure me on that job.It also seemed suspicious bc when I asked the boss what the rate was he said ill have too get back to you on that.I asked him again and he said lets just say its too much.Ive since left this company my boss owes me for one day rate were I can easily see how much it is when I get the check on fri,

It almost looks like his boss was increasing the number of hours instead of the pay rate to make his gross pay total up to what it should (assuming he is not paying jw rate) when he is making pw. I'm not sure why he would do this unless his accounting program would not allow multiple pay scales and he was on pw and non pw jobs the same pay period. Very confusing.

Yes I do have checks for pw and non pw in same pay period but the stubs I posted are 80 hr plus or of just pw. And it still dosnt explain why he would tell me what the rate is on a pw job
 

liquidtite

Senior Member
Location
Ny
this is really simple.

you are an hourly employee.
you are not a salaried employee.

you haven't indicated you are working
under a collective bargaining agreement.
are you? it makes a difference.

you have not indicated if you are working
within a state indentured apprenticeship
program. you would have had to sign papers.
did you? it makes a difference.

if BOTH of the answers to the above questions
are NO, then the man owes you a gross income,
before taxes, of the prevailing wage for all hours
worked.

work in excess of 40 hours per week shall be paid
at the rate of 1.5x the prevailing wage.

so, a 40 hour work week should give you a gross
pay before taxes of $98.13 x 40 = $3,925.40.

it doesn't matter how he lists your pay. it matters
how much the total is. accounting systems vary.
the worlds largest public utility has an accounting
system that is incomprehensible to most of the
people paid under it.

it doesn't matter. we know what the gross should
look like. if you are in a labor union, hours reported
will have a significant effect on pension reporting,
and health and welfare benefits, but that doesn't sound
like what is going on here.

so, focus, check out the two questions above, and then
see how much you got paid for two weeks work.

it should be $7,850.40.

and prevailing wage jobs invariably use certified payroll.

of course, if you were really smart, you'd wait till the job
is over, then file the claim for all the back wages, and
you will get paid.

for all of it.

if you bitch now, you will probably just get laid off.

Call your labor board. this whole things smells fishy.

As far as the pay being to much the EC knows how much he will have to pay going into the job and everyone is supposed to pay the same. Check not only the hourly rate but the fringe that goes along with it.
i called dol and explained what was going on she is currently investigating the matter. Thanks everyone for your time it's appreciated
 

Fulthrotl

~Autocorrect is My Worst Enema.~
Or, as someone speculated, the rate should have been higher and the number of hours reduced to show the PW hourly rate but fewer than actual hours, and the clerk got it backwards.
Or else the contractor was actually fraudulently increasing the payroll on the books and keeping the extra money.

i'm voting for door number three....

and seeing as he's reporting those hours on a certified payroll, he can pay those
hours at the correct wage. bet that gets his attention to what "certified" means.
 
Last edited:

liquidtite

Senior Member
Location
Ny
I called dol and the lady said , that the investigator for the federal building that I was working in contacted the general contractor and she is seeing what the contract says that I was working under . How does that matter isn't it suppose to be set in stone what the rate I should be getting paid? I hope my boss didn't find a loop hole. I asked a laborer that was on the same jobs I was on and he said he was getting paid 50ph. Even if I was under a electrical apprentice that would be 35ph so 22 ph is deff short any way u look at it. I don't see what the contract has to do with it.im going to call in a week to see if theirs any progress
 

gadfly56

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Professional Engineer, Fire & Life Safety
I called dol and the lady said , that the investigator for the federal building that I was working in contacted the general contractor and she is seeing what the contract says that I was working under . How does that matter isn't it suppose to be set in stone what the rate I should be getting paid? I hope my boss didn't find a loop hole. I asked a laborer that was on the same jobs I was on and he said he was getting paid 50ph. Even if I was under a electrical apprentice that would be 35ph so 22 ph is deff short any way u look at it. I don't see what the contract has to do with it.im going to call in a week to see if theirs any progress

I'm a little late to the thread, but we do run PW jobs from time to time.

First, on the accounting method, there may be nothing nefarious here. I once worked for a Fortune 500 company, and at my location it was common to book the non-exempt hours as strictly straight time. So a Saturday shift, which normally was time and a half, would be on the time sheet as 12 straight time hours; 8 for the regular time and 4 for the overtime.

If your job was federal, then state prevailing wage normally does not apply, the Davis-Bacon wage rates apply. For NYC it looks like the base wage for electricians is $51.00/hr with fringes at $23.67. There is no separation into journeyman, apprentice, or anything else. There is a catagory for "Jobbing and maintenance and repair work" which is at $25.30 and $15.13 respectively.

Out of the fringe portion ONLY your employer is allowed to take a credit for things like employer provided health insurance, paid holidays, paid vacation, paid sick or personal days or paid time for off-hours training. He would do this by summing all those hours, calculating the value, and then dividing by the number of work hours in the year (usually 2,080) to get the credit per hour. If you had 10 days paid vacation, 4 sick or personal days and 8 paid holidays per year that would be 176 hours. At $14 per hour the value would be $2,464. Divided by 2,080 that would be $1.85 per hour (rounded). So he could take that as a credit against the $23.67 and the net fringes would be $21.82. The hourly rate that should show up in your pay stub is a total of $72.82, or $38.58 if your job classification was under the "Jobbing" category.

On the "contract" issue, the Feds calculate the Davis-Bacon based on the local union contracts. Electricians in NYC don't get paid the same as electricians in Billings, Montana. This is probably what the DOL rep was referring to. Now that the DOL is involved, you should check in once a week or so to make sure things are moving along. The case should be assigned to an investigator. Find out who that is and try to get their contact information. Drop them an e-mail once a week asking for an update. This is the "squeaky wheel" theory of regulatory enforcement. If you don't hear from them in month, find out who their supervisor is and drop him or her a line. The key to a favorable outcome (for you!) is persistence.
 
Last edited:

liquidtite

Senior Member
Location
Ny
I'm hoping everything works out from what most of the people on here have told me is that it seemes shady and the netpay is low.the dol investigator is seeing what was in the contract witch I was working under.witch i don't get I thought pw is that you have to get paid a set price not what was set in a contract ,dosnt that defeat the purpose?.im going to call dol in a week to get the exact information I didn't have alot of time to talk to her bc I was on my lunch breack .it just seems like pw is tricky to find out what you should be getting paid theirs so many variables .:blink:
 

gadfly56

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Professional Engineer, Fire & Life Safety
I'm hoping everything works out from what most of the people on here have told me is that it seemes shady and the netpay is low.the dol investigator is seeing what was in the contract witch I was working under.witch i don't get I thought pw is that you have to get paid a set price not what was set in a contract ,dosnt that defeat the purpose?.im going to call dol in a week to get the exact information I didn't have alot of time to talk to her bc I was on my lunch breack .it just seems like pw is tricky to find out what you should be getting paid theirs so many variables .:blink:

See my comment above regarding "contract".
 

growler

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,GA
i don't get I thought pw is that you have to get paid a set price not what was set in a contract ,dosnt that defeat the purpose?.

You do get paid the same as every other electrician on the job where you were working.

But it depends on what the classification on this job is, residential, commercial, industrial. and the location of the job.

Once the labor department starts to look into payroll for this job it won't be just you they check out it will be the payroll for the whole job. Anyone that's not paid the proper amount will then be paid. There could be a great deal of money involved here if your boss didn't keep his payroll straight and was under-paying.
 

Fulthrotl

~Autocorrect is My Worst Enema.~
You do get paid the same as every other electrician on the job where you were working.

But it depends on what the classification on this job is, residential, commercial, industrial. and the location of the job.

Once the labor department starts to look into payroll for this job it won't be just you they check out it will be the payroll for the whole job. Anyone that's not paid the proper amount will then be paid. There could be a great deal of money involved here if your boss didn't keep his payroll straight and was under-paying.

that's why the call it certified payroll..... :p

people fickle with payroll every so often, attempting
to cheat the employees.... i'd call it an honest mistake,
except in over 30 years, honest mistakes sometimes
would be overpayment, and sometimes underpayment.

will all those suffering from overpayment please raise their
hands?

my wife is director of compensation for a large company,
and when i was working for LADWP, she was incensed at
some of the payroll practices they get away with on the
exempt (non civil service) hourly employees.

short pays frequently take over 90 days to correct. and
short pays occur often.

as for prevailing wage jobs, the job you are doing has
a prevailing wage for a geographic area. that is what
your total package should amount to.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top