AFCI breakers do they really protect as advertised!

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Strife

Senior Member
I'm not a rocket scientist, but I know enough about physics to know the AFCI's are not what they're cracked to be.
1: Their effectiveness. Is it an arc causing a fire? or is it just an appliance with a motor?
I had the same question in another thread and some mentioned that the breaker has a computer that recognizes certain "things" when an arc occurs and it can differentiate between a motor in a vacuum cleaner and the cord burning(of the same vacuum). Of course that information on HOW they recognize it is PROPRIETARY. But this is not all. Let's look at computers in general and video games in particular. There's only 12-20 video cards out there, but you get a game and GUARANTEED it will not work on ALL the video cards. Now how exactly do we make a program to recognize thousands of different appliances? Furthermore, ever had a program that worked fine in Windows 98, but never can get it to work on windows 7? Every year appliances are changing. Is there a software update for these AFCI's?
2: I hate it the way this was shoved down our throat. Is there ANY study on how many houses are burning because fires caused by arcs. Was there any testing done on this? I mean the drug industry has to have a drug tested for YEARS just to prove it doesn't cause itching when smoking pot on top of Everest when temperature is 90 degrees. Has this kind of scrutiny been done to AFCI before we created another tens of billions of dollars tax? Sure, it can always be safer, so no scrutiny needed there.
3: As someone else mentioned: There's no guarantee that once the arc occurred it won't take it's course of igniting any materials around that can be ignited even if the breaker has opened. Let's be serious: How many of you have seen cords, cables wires that were melted 5 feet from one end to another? usually it's a 2-3 inch spot.
4: Is this new tax imposed on people really worth it? There's a limit on how much it can be spent on certain things. As much as we hate it, not EVERYONE can have EVERYTHING. How about the people that would like to fix some things around, but they can't afford it because a panel change just went from 400-500 bucks to 2K? And that's not including the permit price.

In recent threads and posts there has been banter regarding the effectiveness and performance of AFCI breakers. There is also claims that the manufactures claim of certain protection features my be false. I am starting this thread to promote conversation as well as substantiation of the issue. If anyone has documentation on the subject please comment.
If anyone has a copy of the UL 1999 please post what you can.

Here is a link to the IEEE document that was refrenced in another thread:
http://www.combinationafci.com/resou...ation_afci.pdf
 

cowboyjwc

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Simi Valley, CA
I know I haven't mentioned it in this post, but I have mentioned it before, If you don't agree with what your jurisdiction is doing, you need to get together with some of the other local contractors and meet with the local building official. And DO NOT try to use cost as your reasoning. Remember this, most panel changes are like elective surgery, no one said you needed to do it, that was a choice you made.

That said, jurisdictions that are asking for AFCI's on panel changes don't really understand how they work either. Hard to put an AFCI on an old MWBC. New construction or additions to existing buildings being supplied by new circuits is when they should be required.

And one more thing, when the day comes and the AFCI won't reset and you're cussing and complainging and then find the chared cord under the chared rug that didn't catch fire, as I did, you'll look like a hero and/or change your opinion.
 
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