GFCI Not Required

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LEO2854

LEO2854

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hurk27 said:
Ok found the code Don was talking about, 620.85 in the elevator pit, the machine room can have the breaker though, it doesn't make sense why a GFCI breaker can not be used in Lieu of the receptacle but it does require the receptacle version?:confused:

As for the OP question as worded, the only place in the NEC that I can find that specifically says not to use a GFCI, is 210.8(A)(5) exception.

ok I'm done searching for a while lol:D
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hurk.
If you have the 2008 handbook look at the commontery on 620.85,
the first paragraph of 620.85 requires GFCI -type receptacle for each 15-and 20-amp recpetacle installed in pits,on elavator car tops , and in escalator and moving walk well ways. This requirment is based on the premise that the reset push button for a tripped GFCI receptacle should be within easy reach of an elevator mechanic working in confined spaces.
The second paragraph of 620.85 requires that all 15- and 20- amp receptacles
installed in machine rooms and machinery spaces have GFCI protection for personnel.
This protection can be affored by either a GFCI-type circuit breaker or a GFCI-type receptacle because machine room spaces usually do not cause access hazards for service personnel.
:grin:so i hope that was what don was talking about:grin:
 
R

Rouse

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jumper said:
Are you on 2005 or 2008? Some of the exceptions are gone in 2008.
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2008 of course. The point of the question was to find a few loop-holes to the gfci requirements. Like I said its been a few months since I took the test so I am not sure If that was how the choices were worded. I was just wondering with all experience with the code everyone here has had, If you have come across any of these loop-holes anywhere in the code book?
 
jumper

jumper

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Rouse said:
2008 of course. The point of the question was to find a few loop-holes to the gfci requirements. Like I said its been a few months since I took the test so I am not sure If that was how the choices were worded. I was just wondering with all experience with the code everyone here has had, If you have come across any of these loop-holes anywhere in the code book?
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I guess I am lost on what "loop holes" you are looking for, 210.8 has specific exceptions allowed.
 
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Rouse

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jumper said:
I guess I am lost on what "loop holes" you are looking for, 210.8 has specific exceptions allowed.
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The question is in multiple choice format (a,b,c,d,e). The question was where are GFCI recps. not required? Pick 3 correct answers. The only options I remember from the test were A.)when a single recp. is used, B.)for a fridge recp., and C.)a recp in an unfinished basement for an appliance of piece of equipment not easily moved? Maybe one more in a garage where the recp. is not readily accessible? Like I said I can't remember exactly how they were worded but they were definitely not the obvious exceptions in 210.8.
 
jumper

jumper

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Rouse said:
The question is in multiple choice format (a,b,c,d,e). The question was where are GFCI recps. not required? Pick 3 correct answers. The only options I remember from the test were A.)when a single recp. is used, B.)for a fridge recp., and C.)a recp in an unfinished basement for an appliance of piece of equipment not easily moved? Maybe one more in a garage where the recp. is not readily accessible? Like I said I can't remember exactly how they were worded but they were definitely not the obvious exceptions in 210.8.
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None of those answers as worded apply as exceptions in 2008.
 
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Rouse

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jumper said:
None of those answers as worded apply as exceptions in 2008.
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I don't think that is exactly how they were worded. I am just going off of memory. If those options were worded differently would that make them apply as any of the exceptions?
 
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hurk27

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Location
Portage, Indiana NEC: 2008
Rouse said:
The question is in multiple choice format (a,b,c,d,e). The question was where are GFCI recps. not required? Pick 3 correct answers. The only options I remember from the test were A.)when a single recp. is used, B.)for a fridge recp., and C.)a recp in an unfinished basement for an appliance of piece of equipment not easily moved? Maybe one more in a garage where the recp. is not readily accessible? Like I said I can't remember exactly how they were worded but they were definitely not the obvious exceptions in 210.8.
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as worded those possible answers are worded for code cycle 2005 and earlier.

the only exceptions left in the 2008 is the one I posted above: 210.8(A)(5) exception.

and 210.8(A)(3) exception, for outdoor receptacles for snow melt and de-icing equipment.

Are you sure this test is based upon the 2008?
 
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H

hurk27

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Location
Portage, Indiana NEC: 2008
they could be trying to see if the test taker realizes the changes that was made in 2008 by putting in answers that was accepted in 2005 and earlier, if the options are there for the two above mentioned exceptions then this is what their doing.
 
jumper

jumper

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Rouse said:
I don't think that is exactly how they were worded. I am just going off of memory. If those options were worded differently would that make them apply as any of the exceptions?
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As far as a single rec, nothing I know of.

The dedicated appliance/not accessible rec is gone.

The fridge is tricky. Comm or resi, SABC or not, kitchen or not, sink within 6ft. I can elaborate if this is confusing.
 
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Rouse

Member
hurk27 said:
they could be trying to see if the test taker realizes the changes that was made in 2008 by putting in answers that was accepted in 2005 and earlier, if the options are there for the two above mentioned exceptions then this is what their doing.
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Those exceptions were not options I went strait to them after I first read the question and answers. You think they could be looking for the 2005 changes? The whole test was multiple choice but most questions wanted multiple answers intended to make you really dig because usually the answers were not together in the NEC.
 
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Rouse

Member
jumper said:
As far as a single rec, nothing I know of.

The dedicated appliance/not accessible rec is gone.

The fridge is tricky. Comm or resi, SABC or not, kitchen or not, sink within 6ft. I can elaborate if this is confusing.
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I don't remember for the fridge. A fridge recp. installed in a dwelling unit kitchen, would it have to be gfci if it is for the fridge and not serving counter tops as in 210.8(A)(6)?
 
R

Rouse

Member
jumper said:
As far as a single rec, nothing I know of.

The dedicated appliance/not accessible rec is gone.

The fridge is tricky. Comm or resi, SABC or not, kitchen or not, sink within 6ft. I can elaborate if this is confusing.
Click to expand...

I don't remember about the fridge. If a recp. is installed in a dwelling unit kitchen for a fridge (i.e. near the floor) not intended to serve counter tops, does it have to be gfci? I am referring to 210.8(A)(6).
 
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