new title 24 requirements effective 01-01-14 in calif.......

[Fulthrotl]

I am assuming that the agenda item was passed at the meeting yesterday. Below is the item from the agenda. Just curious, did Leslie state that the agenda item was passed? The minutes of the meeting have not been posted. I don't see an announcement on the 2013 Standards homepage. It's a little soon to expect anything though.

INDUSTRY CERTIFICATION THRESHOLD FOR LIGHTING CONTROLSACCEPTANCE TEST TECHNICIAN AND EMPLOYER CERTIFICATION REQUIREMENTS. Proposedresolution finding that the required conditions have been met for the Number ofCertified Lighting Acceptance Test Technicians as set forth in Section10-103-A(b)1 and for Industry Coverage by Certification Providers as set forthin 10-103-A(b)2 of the 2013 Building Energy Efficiency Standards; anddetermining that, upon consideration of factors such as certification costs,certification marketing materials, prequalification criteria, classavailability, and curriculum, that reasonable access to certification has been providedby Certification Providers approved by the Energy Commission. Contact: TavCommins. (15 minutes)

no, she didn't, but the director of the program, who i got by mistake by calling the 213 number, said it was passed yesterday.

 

[sandsnow]

Thanks

 

[Fulthrotl]

may i have the check, please?

may i have the check, please?

signed the agreement for calctp-at contractor today.

there was some interest expressed about the audit fee structure
that will be in place... this is a capture of the contract language:



they are estimating a total of 20% audits, mostly desk review, but some field audits as well. randomly done, of course.

let's see.... i'm an auditor... and i have to do field audits.... hmmm.... fontana, or santa barbara, or huntington beach during
the OP surf competition and swimsuit fling a thong.....

lets see... random... um, sure.... random... i see huntington beach as a hotbed of compliance violations.... better start there....

i will assume a 100% field audit sample in my billing structure. and allow an extra $30 for lunch at sanchos' tacos on PCH.
the auditor can come along if he wants for fling a thong certification. shouldn't be a problem. they are well flung hereabouts.

 

[Fulthrotl]

well, progress marches on, i suppose.....

well, progress marches on, i suppose.....

"Currently we do not have any certified acceptance technician contractors and technicians in the system."

haven't heard anything back from them yet... i suspect they are pretty badly buried under work.

 

[Fulthrotl]

well, it seems they processed a bunch of back paperwork, and everyone is now up on the
website that was in the system and just floating... interestingly enough, i've gotten three
people wanting to know if my certificate is now active, in the last week or so.... and today
my electrical engineer asked if i was ready to accept referrals... he's been having some
queries.... so i better hurry up and clear off the work in front of me in the next couple months.

the website is still pretty fuzzled, and there are a lot of contractors certified that don't
show up on the tab for looking at the approved contractors, but a search gets your name up....
we'll see what happens....

 

[Sierrasparky]

signed the agreement for calctp-at contractor today.

there was some interest expressed about the audit fee structure
that will be in place... this is a capture of the contract language:



they are estimating a total of 20% audits, mostly desk review, but some field audits as well. randomly done, of course.

let's see.... i'm an auditor... and i have to do field audits.... hmmm.... fontana, or santa barbara, or huntington beach during
the OP surf competition and swimsuit fling a thong.....

lets see... random... um, sure.... random... i see huntington beach as a hotbed of compliance violations.... better start there....

i will assume a 100% field audit sample in my billing structure. and allow an extra $30 for lunch at sanchos' tacos on PCH.
the auditor can come along if he wants for fling a thong certification. shouldn't be a problem. they are well flung hereabouts.

Yea what a scam on all of us.


Ca Title 24 law required the auditing to be done by independant or what I would think would be a seperate non affiliated company.
ICF and CALCTP appear to be the same people.
The person in charge works for both ICF and CALCTP.
The staff also appear to work for both CALCTP and ICF. Look at your paperwork you will see both.

So tell me how this is independant auditing!!!!!!

SO Corrupt. in my opinion.

 

[EasternThunderbolts]

Electrician

Electrician

"This article contains administrative regulations relating to the energy building
regulations in Title 24, Part 6. This article applies to all residential and nonresidential buildings."

certificate of occupancy will not be issued until the project is commissioned and certified as in
compliance with applicable regulations.

get this:

http://www.energy.ca.gov/2012publications/CEC-400-2012-004/CEC-400-2012-004-CMF-REV.pdf

and start reading. there is a lot to cover.

Ugh! More paperwork!

 

[Fulthrotl]

Ugh! More paperwork!

but you're in joisey...?

this is left coast koolaid, at least at this point in time.

got a call from one of my customers, asking yesterday about that
calcatwhachakallit thing. seems a local AHJ here is requiring it for
exterior illuminated signs. yup. LED sign on the side of a building,
needs the cert.

i need to clear my backlog of work, so i can properly address this thing.
am doing 12 hours sat and sun. i am NOT working on labor day, dammit!

y'all have a nice weekend.....

 

[sandsnow]

but you're in joisey...?

this is left coast koolaid, at least at this point in time.

got a call from one of my customers, asking yesterday about that
calcatwhachakallit thing. seems a local AHJ here is requiring it for
exterior illuminated signs. yup. LED sign on the side of a building,
needs the cert.

i need to clear my backlog of work, so i can properly address this thing.
am doing 12 hours sat and sun. i am NOT working on labor day, dammit!

y'all have a nice weekend.....

So are you saying he wants an ATT to certify controls for a sign?
Not required.
There is no Acceptance Form for sign control. There is a Installation Cert, but this can be signed by just about anybody
NO Acceptance Form = No ATT
Here is a link to all forms - Compliance Forms, Installation Certs, Acceptance Forms

http://www.energy.ca.gov/title24/2013standards/nonres_compliance_forms/

 

[GoldDigger]

I am imagining an "occupancy sensor" for an outdoor sign that only lights it up when there is someone around to see it. The range needed might be difficult, and the results startling. :angel:

 

[Fulthrotl]

I am imagining an "occupancy sensor" for an outdoor sign that only lights it up when there is someone around to see it. The range needed might be difficult, and the results startling. :angel:

this one needs to have a sensor that can pick up cars going by on the 405 freeway, 200 yards away.

no, a 365 day asshological timeclock will do nicely. along with the forms certifying it complies with
T24:2013, of course.

the papers may cover more square footage than the sign.

 

[Fulthrotl]

finally did my first T24:2013 certification today.
company does a lot of strip mall build outs....
we shall see if they call for additional units...
they do a lot of strip mall stuff, it seems.

 

[mgookin]

finally did my first T24:2013 certification today.
company does a lot of strip mall build outs....
we shall see if they call for additional units...
they do a lot of strip mall stuff, it seems.

What are you certifying? The installation complies with the plans which comply with T24?

 

[Fulthrotl]

What are you certifying? The installation complies with the plans which comply with T24?

well..... yeah.
i am also certifying that i am certified to certify this.

:ashamed1:

saying that three times really fast makes you dizzy.

 

[augie47]

we've come a long way.................... it used to be so simple....

 

[John120/240]

The California Advanced Lighting Controls Training Program-Acceptance Technician
(CALCTP-AT) certifies acceptance technician employers and technicians.



:

well..... yeah.
i am also certifying that i am certified to certify this.

.

So can you certify your own jobs that you have designed/installed ? Isn't this like the Fox guarding the Chicken House ? The job of the city/county inspector is still limited to NEC code violations, correct ?

 

[Sierrasparky]

So can you certify your own jobs that you have designed/installed ? Isn't this like the Fox guarding the Chicken House ? The job of the city/county inspector is still limited to NEC code violations, correct ?

Yup , That's the way it works this cycle.

 

[Fulthrotl]

So can you certify your own jobs that you have designed/installed ? Isn't this like the Fox guarding the Chicken House ? The job of the city/county inspector is still limited to NEC code violations, correct ?

yup to all of that... dunno about the fox security service however.

however, the inspector will have to see the appropriate certifications and
forms have been filled out at final... if the forms are there, his scope of
authority is the NEC. if they aren't there, he leaves, as you aren't ready for final.

 

[sandsnow]

We still look at title 24 as part of our inspection. I have job right now where the plans call for automatic daylighting and the contractor did not put it in.
I would say the only thing we do not do is verify or check up on the person doing the acceptance testing.

 

[Fulthrotl]

We still look at title 24 as part of our inspection. I have job right now where the plans call for automatic daylighting and the contractor did not put it in.
I would say the only thing we do not do is verify or check up on the person doing the acceptance testing.

but the approved drawings were not followed, so it doesn't make any difference from your
point of view what wasn't followed, just that it wasn't.... yes? a 100 amp subpanel being
substituted for a 200 amp panel shown on the prints would have the same effect as the
lighting not being compliant?

so this job didn't make it to final inspection, did it? i'm just baffled that something this significant
got left out....

it is kinda interesting that there doesn't seem to be any checks and balances to assure that
the person doing the certification is approved to do so... engineered drawings have a stamp, etc.