nm cable

[Brent Peterson]

is nm cable allowed to be run from the inside of a house to a light on the out side of the house. Acording to the 2008 code nm is not permitted in wet or damp location which i belive this is. Is there an excemption i missied that will allow me to do so.

Thank you for responses,
Let me try agin the outside of a building is a wet location, nm cable is not allowed in a wet loaction. I know i can put wire in a bell box or a approved light fixture for a wet location but the area is still a wet location even by putting a bell box under the light fixture is saying it is a wet loaction, so my question is not if i can keep the wires dry but is there an exception or code that allows me to use NM and if so where can I find it.

 

[mdshunk]

This is sure to be good....

If you ask me, how could the area behind an outdoor fixture be a wet or damp location and still have the building pass building codes? The substrate would rot out and mold would grow. I maintain that a properly installed outdoor fixture effectively creates a dry zone behind it. I don't wire to account for improper installation of outdoor fixtures, no more than I'd put a bubble cover on the disposal receptacle in case there's a leak under the sink.

 

[LawnGuyLandSparky]

Well the box would be inside the building envelope...

 

[480sparky]

Well the box would be inside the building envelope...

What about using a surface-mounted bell box with NM running in to it?

 

[dwellselectric]

I thought a bell box was weather proof sparky

 

[480sparky]

I thought a bell box was weather proof sparky

But is the inside of the bell box still a wet location if the bell box is in a wet location?

 

[Brent Peterson]

thanks for the replys I know i could put the wires in a bell box, install a box to keep the wires dry, but from the new code this area is a wet location and nm cable is listed for a wet location even if runs in conduit.
Is there exception that allows me to use nm in wet loaction if it is an approved fixture or box for a wet area

 

[dwellselectric]

Installed properly I dont think its supposed to get wet

 

[don_resqcapt19]

I don't recall a change in the defintion of wet locations for the 2008 code. Are you thinking of the new rule in 300.9? If so that section only applies to raceways.

 

[infinity]

But is the inside of the bell box still a wet location if the bell box is in a wet location?

No it isn't. Did you have a specific article in mind that would make it a wet location?

 

[jshaw]

I just got back from a 2008 code update class sponsored by the Idaho chapter of the IAEI. This issue was discussed there. As it stands now, technically NM could not be run to an outside fixture. However, the State has said they are not going to do anything about enforcing this issue right now because they feel it was an oversight and in the next code cycle it will be addressed with an exception or a new definition.

 

[mdshunk]

As it stands now, technically NM could not be run to an outside fixture.

Why do you (they) feel that way?

 

[jshaw]

Because in 334.12 (B) of the 2008 they added to uses not permitted "In wet or damp locations" So, theoretically any location outdoors whether in a box, conduit, is considered to be wet or damp location.

 

[mdshunk]

Because in 334.12 (B) of the 2008 they added to uses not permitted "In wet or damp locations" So, theoretically any location outdoors whether in a box, conduit, is considered to be wet or damp location.

What if that "box" is within the building envelope?? Do they intend to start making people use recessed Bell boxes for exterior flush mounted fixtures?

 

[jshaw]

I think their biggest concern was NM that was poked outside a structure and into a surface mounted metal box on the siding. The impression I got was that this was not intended by the code making panel when they added the new not permitted use. They just overlooked some of the possibilities that a Nazi inspector might decide to start enforcing.

 

[electricman2]

But is the inside of the bell box still a wet location if the bell box is in a wet location?

No it isn't. Did you have a specific article in mind that would make it a wet location?

I know the OP is about NM but consider this. The inside of a raceway installed outside is a wet location but the inside of a bell box installed outside is a dry location. Water is much more likely to enter the box than the raceway. This makes sense how?

 

[electricalperson]

I know the OP is about NM but consider this. The inside of a raceway installed outside is a wet location but the inside of a bell box installed outside is a dry location. Water is much more likely to enter the box than the raceway. This makes sense how?

so are we saying running romex to a bell box is technically illegal?

 

[infinity]

I know the OP is about NM but consider this. The inside of a raceway installed outside is a wet location but the inside of a bell box installed outside is a dry location. Water is much more likely to enter the box than the raceway. This makes sense how?

OK so what is the code article that you would use to back up the statement that the inside of a box is a wet location? The specifically tells us that the inside of the raceway outside is a wet location. Is there specific code wording in the NEC that makes this concept apply to the interior of a box?

 

[electricman2]

OK so what is the code article that you would use to back up the statement that the inside of a box is a wet location? The specifically tells us that the inside of the raceway outside is a wet location. Is there specific code wording in the NEC that makes this concept apply to the interior of a box?

There isn't one, thats the point. If a raceway outside is a wet location, shouldn't a box be too since just as likely to accumulate moisture?

 

[buck33k]

Are ALL raceways installed outside considered to be in a wet or damp location? What would be the code reference?