What would you do? 5kw Gen w/ATS and as stubborn customer

[ultramegabob]

I believe if you have a normally closed set of contacts, the A/C should work as normal, but when the transfer switch engauges, you will open that ciruit and not allow the thermostat to turn the conderser on. Maybe there is someone who specializes in HVAC on here that can give some input....

Edit- nevermind, I keep thinking you are using a whole house transfer switch and not a seperate panel....

 

[Mule]

I believe if you have a normally closed set of contacts, the A/C should work as normal, but when the transfer switch engauges, you will open that ciruit and not allow the thermostat to turn the conderser on. Maybe there is someone who specializes in HVAC on here that can give some input....

I hear what your saying,and I can tell your a creative get'r done, can-do guy..:smile: but if I leave the branch circuit out of the gen load panel, and keep it in the main panel, when it flips to gen, the condenser cant come on, due to no line power. It will only have power via the main panel.

 

[kbsparky]

That sounds like the ticket. Let the air handler continue to run, but keep the compressor out of it.

They'll think that the A/C is on, since air will be blowing out of the vents.

 

[Mule]

That sounds like the ticket. Let the air handler continue to run, but keep the compressor out of it.

They'll think that the A/C is on, since air will be blowing out of the vents.

It will be a freaky day for her to need A/C while on generator....around here the tornado early spring storms, and ice winter seasons are the only reasonable ''at risk" seasons.

 

[LarryFine]

install normally closed relays and feed the coils from the line side of the transfer switch, when you lose power the transfer swith engauges, it turns off those loads, when the utilties power come back on, it turns them back on automatically....

I'd just break the 24v line to the compressor (as long as the heat isn't electric.)

 

[ultramegabob]

I hear what your saying,and I can tell your a creative get'r done, can-do guy..:smile: but if I leave the branch circuit out of the gen load panel, and keep it in the main panel, when it flips to gen, the condenser cant come on, due to no line power. It will only have power via the main panel.

figguring out stuff like this is the fun part of electrical work for me, but since you have two panels that is the simple solution...

 

[Mule]

figguring out stuff like this is the fun part of electrical work for me, but since you have two panels that is the simple solution...

So how about my other situation (gen at the museum)? figure that one out for me...:smile: its a future project that hasnt come up yet, but it will be soon. I think I have it figured out in my head, but need to put it down on paper...its a odd ball

 

[ultramegabob]

how many circuits?

 

[Mule]

how many circuits?

Currently four, in a load panel all 20 amp emerg lighting. They only want them energized upon loss of power.

Future....adding two circuits for gift shop lighting that will work as normal, both under utility and gen power....

Standard ATS switch, from Generac 14kw single phase 120/240

 

[ultramegabob]

feed a small transfer panel like you are using in your friends house from your generator fed panel that you already have. and have it select between the utility power and generator back up...

 

[B4T]

Seems like a waste of money to move such a small generator.

I would put an amp meter on the load side of ATS and show customer exactly how much undersized the generator is.

Be much smarter to buy a new, larger generator and sell the 5 kw on Craigs list.

Maybe you get to install both :grin:

 

[Mule]

feed a transfer panel like you are using from the house from your transfer panel that you already have. and have it select between the utility power and generator back up...

Currently we have disabled the ATS to stay in the "GEN" mode. So when it senses loss of power it starts and brings up the load panel that is fed from the load side of the ATS.

So Im thinking about returning the ATS back to normal operation, and let the gift shop lights function as normal either on utility or gen.

As for the emg lights, as suggested earlier, feed the emg lighting panel via a lighting contactor. The coil on the contactor to be only energized from a N.C. relay held open via the presence of utility power. This control power will have to be 24v derived from the generator.

 

[ultramegabob]

Currently we have disabled the ATS to stay in the "GEN" mode. So when it senses loss of power it starts and brings up the load panel that is fed from the load side of the ATS.

So Im thinking about returning the ATS back to normal operation, and let the gift shop lights function as normal either on utility or gen.

As for the emg lights, as suggested earlier, feed the emg lighting panel via a lighting contactor. The coil on the contactor to be only energized from a N.C. relay held open via the presence of utility power. This control power will have to be 24v derived from the generator.

that sounds like a good way to do it, I was having a hard time picturing what you have going on by reading it, lol...

 

[Mule]

Seems like a waste of money to move such a small generator.

I would put an amp meter on the load side of ATS and show customer exactly how much undersized the generator is.

Be much smarter to buy a new, larger generator and sell the 5 kw on Craigs list.

Maybe you get to install both :grin:

Idealy I agree, but money is very tight around here, and its a miracle they are doing what they're doing, work just trickles in "just in time" we are down to a week or so, back log.......I doubt she'll ever need the ac unit under back up power situations.....Ive just got to convince her of that.....:smile:

 

[Mule]

that sounds like a good way to do it, I was having a hard time picturing what you have going on by reading it, lol...

Yea ,and Im not a very good explainer..either.......hittin the hay guys, vacation wore me out....good night

 

[Mule]

It will be a freaky day for her to need A/C while on generator....around here the tornado early spring storms, and ice winter seasons are the only reasonable ''at risk" seasons.

Customer finally decided to trust me, and has agreed to delete putting the A/C condenser on the 5kw generator. This lady, bless her heart, can't think for herself, OR trust anyone else to do it for her......

 

[SEO]

Glad for you Mule.

 

[nez]

For your gift shop situation. We have used relays I believe they were called Rib-E or something like that. They attach to a jbox thru a 1/2 inch ko. They have a 120 volt coil and a dry set of no and nc contacts. Wire your emergency only circuits nc and feed the coil with normal power. Wire your gift shop circuits as desired. On many jobs we have emergency lights on wall switches but we have to wire a rib-e relay to bypass the swithleg in the event of a power outage.

 

[hillbilly1]

For your gift shop situation. We have used relays I believe they were called Rib-E or something like that. They attach to a jbox thru a 1/2 inch ko. They have a 120 volt coil and a dry set of no and nc contacts. Wire your emergency only circuits nc and feed the coil with normal power. Wire your gift shop circuits as desired. On many jobs we have emergency lights on wall switches but we have to wire a rib-e relay to bypass the swithleg in the event of a power outage.

RIB relay, AKA Relay in a box, made by Functional Devices, nice little units, multiple voltage capabilities in on box.

 

[rt66electric]

Get a window unit

Get a window unit

Tell her it would bet cheaperto get a window unit(or such) to keep one room coooool during outages. A window unit is alot less expensive than other alternatives.