'X' receptacles?

[fmtjfw]

Countries in the EU don't use any kinds of plugs with flat prongs that I ever saw (UK prongs are flat sided, but are too bulky to be considered "flat"). Most use some variant of the Schuko plug with either the side grounds or a ground pin mounted in the socket or a combination type cord end. The down side to this system is that ground equipped cord ends can be plugged into non grounded receptacles in many countries. They also don't pay attention to polarity like we do.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_power_plugs_and_sockets

It actually all over the map, no pun intended. All sorts of combinations, polarized/unpolarized.

 

[K8MHZ]

Update:

I just got this e-mail from UL:

UL PIRs

2012FR-1745 for UL File E243553
2012FR-1746 for Titan Controls Internet Website

Hello Mr. Derby.

Thank you for taking the time to contact UL with your product concern.

Based on the information you provided, two Product Incident Report (PIR) investigations have been opened and assigned to Mr. Bill Perry, UL Market Surveillance Report Investigator.

If you have additional information or questions, please contact the investigator at William.L.Perry@ul.com or by phone at 1-847-664-1523 (Northbrook, IL, USA).

We would like to assure you that the information you provide will be thoroughly reviewed and appropriate action will be taken as warranted. We will notify you upon completion of this investigation.

Thank you for bringing this matter to our attention.

Regards,

Ms. Lorene Seeger
Market Surveillance Analyst
________________________
UL LLC
333 Pfingsten Road
Northbrook, IL 60062
Email: Market.Surveillance@ul.com
W: ul.com

Well, at least they seem to be interested. I wonder how long the investigation will take. As noted in the e-mail, additional information may be of value to them. If any of you have said information, I will forward it, or it can be sent to them via the e-mail address they provided.

 

[fmtjfw]

Update:

I just got this e-mail from UL:



Well, at least they seem to be interested. I wonder how long the investigation will take. As noted in the e-mail, additional information may be of value to them. If any of you have said information, I will forward it, or it can be sent to them via the e-mail address they provided.

As I recall UL has a good relationship with Customs. When UL finds something counterfeit, they require it to be destroyed, rather than say, turned over to them for possible distribution through "dollar stores" (as a type not a specific chain). Customs likes to work with companies that call for destruction. Some other companies try to make a buck on the counterfeits of their products.

 

[jmellc]

Nope:

406.4 General Installation Requirements.
(F) Noninterchangeable Types. Receptacles connected to circuits that have different voltages, frequencies, or types of current (ac or dc) on the same premises shall be of such design that the attachment plugs used on these circuits are not interchangeable.

The receptacle as pictured as several problems:
1) it is not polarized for 2 prong plugs (allows neutral prong t be plugged in to hot slot.
2) as stated as a "feature" it allows 120v/240v wiring and accepts 120v and 240v plugs.

Note the face seems very clean with out any hint of a NRTL listing or voltage or amperage rating.

TROUBLE!! I can see now the complications that would arise out of using this recep. I myself would never think of checking voltage on a 120 look alike. Most people outside the trade would never think twice about using this recep for radios, clocks, etc. May even catch a few of us in our more tired moments, after a long hard day. If I were forced to use an odd outlet for matching plug, I'd have it marked all over with warnings. Would be a temporary last resort at best, until I could get proper stuff. Gotta keep one eye open now for this kind of thing.

 

[K8MHZ]

The two cases have been assigned to a Market Surveillance Engineer. He has contacted me for some additional info and maybe some better detailed pictures. The pics are on Photobucket

www.photobucket.com/E243553

The UL guy wants more detailed pics. I think they are OK and maybe he only saw the thumbs?

I will be happy to re-shoot, of course, but what should I be trying to improve???

 

[tleaf28]

http://database.ul.com/cgi-bin/XYV/template/LISEXT/1FRAME/showpage.html?name=RTRT.E243553&ccnshorttitle=Receptacles+for+Plugs+and+Attachment+Plugs&objid=1077373118&cfgid=1073741824&version=versionless&parent_id=1073992975&sequence=1


There's not much in their UL file to go off of other than the file # is legitimate.

Two theories:
1. Maybe they are trying to save on mold charges and manufacturing these for sale elsewhere besides USA and Canada?
2. Someone stole this file number and these are counterfeit receptacles.

 

[TimK]

There's not much in their UL file to go off of other than the file # is legitimate.

Two theories:
1. Maybe they are trying to save on mold charges and manufacturing these for sale elsewhere besides USA and Canada?
2. Someone stole this file number and these are counterfeit receptacles.[/QUOTE]

Just because I am not sure how this works, but I have noticed that the device and UL sheet are only listed as 125, maybe they are advertising what is not UL listed?

 

[fmtjfw]

http://database.ul.com/cgi-bin/XYV/template/LISEXT/1FRAME/showpage.html?name=RTRT.E243553&ccnshorttitle=Receptacles+for+Plugs+and+Attachment+Plugs&objid=1077373118&cfgid=1073741824&version=versionless&parent_id=1073992975&sequence=1


There's not much in their UL file to go off of other than the file # is legitimate.

Two theories:
1. Maybe they are trying to save on mold charges and manufacturing these for sale elsewhere besides USA and Canada?
2. Someone stole this file number and these are counterfeit receptacles.

There is probably nothing different from this receptacle and a legitimate one other than the face plate. The yoke is just a part with the file number already punched into it. The "rupturing" is a bit strange. The back only lists 125V.

 

[K8MHZ]

There is probably nothing different from this receptacle and a legitimate one other than the face plate. The yoke is just a part with the file number already punched into it. The "rupturing" is a bit strange. The back only lists 125V.

"Not for current rupturing" is in the nomenclature of plugs that can be used as disconnects:

Plugs may be withdrawn in an emergency under full rated loads without separate disconnect switches (400 Amp plug for disconnecting use only; not for current rupturing).

http://datasheets.globalspec.com/ds/4341/AppletonElectric/6645E546-9776-4516-B449-63C7CC15DD02

 

[fmtjfw]

"Not for current rupturing" is in the nomenclature of plugs that can be used as disconnects:



http://datasheets.globalspec.com/ds/4341/AppletonElectric/6645E546-9776-4516-B449-63C7CC15DD02

Yes, but for a 15amp receptacle? Never seen it on a 15/20A 125/250V duplex receptacle before.

 

[K8MHZ]

Yes, but for a 15amp receptacle? Never seen it on a 15/20A 125/250V duplex receptacle before.

Me either. I found the info by searching the net.

 

[K8MHZ]

More update:

I have been requested to send one of the receptacles to the UL. I just got it packed, it will go in the mail tomorrow.

I don't think they are fooling around. The address I was asked to send the receptacle to was 101 S. Military Way, Green Bay, WI.

Sounds pretty ominous, does it not??

So far I am pretty impressed with the way the UL is handling my complaint. WAY faster than the FCC!!!

 

[K8MHZ]

Further update:

I sent one of the receptacles I had in. I got an e-mail saying that the UL had purchased 'X' receptacles from other sources and none of them had an actual UL mark. It seems mine may be a bit of a rare find. They are looking into at least the one place that they know is selling them, but I don't think there is much they can do sans an actual UL mark for the other places selling them. But, with no listing, we are looking at an NEC issue.

Anyone else see the ones like I have? Universal WITH the UL mark on the back?

 

[jim dungar]

I don't think they are fooling around. The address I was asked to send the receptacle to was 101 S. Military Way, Green Bay, WI.

I am not aware of any UL facility in Green Bay.
The address you list, is for a UPS store, in a strip-mall.

 

[renosteinke]

"Field Reports" are handled for UL by their "Follow Up Service" department. These are UL employees who actually visit manufacturing facilities, consult with inspectors, etc. Such folks are scattered all over the place, and typically only visit the 'office' every month or so.

It's likely the issue has been assigned to the FUS person who normally interacts with the actual manufacturer behind the 'file number.' His review will determine where UL goes next.

 

[HoosierSparky]

2011 NEC Article 110.2 - " The conductors and EQUIPMENT required or perjitted by this Code shall be acceptable only IF approved."

2011 NEC Article 110.3 (B) - " Installation and Use. LISTED and LABELED equipment shall be installed and used in accordace with any instructions included in the LISTING OR LABELING."

These two code sections makes the determination of being able to use the "x" recept easy...NO!

Additionally with UL investigating, there definately is no listing. The label is used in violation.

I had a job that had direct burial up lights comprised of listed components. The ASSEMBLY was NOT listed. It had been submitted, but had not, yet been approved. In order to use these, the tenent paid for ETL to send out one of thier engineers to fly out, twice, until they were approved. The engineer labeled the fixtures as a LISTED ASSEMBLY. :slaphead:

 

[jim dungar]

"Field Reports" are handled for UL by their "Follow Up Service" department.

:thumbsup:

 

[K8MHZ]

I am not aware of any UL facility in Green Bay.
The address you list, is for a UPS store, in a strip-mall.

There was also a UPS box #. I just didn't include it in my post.

 

[jim dungar]

There was also a UPS box #. I just didn't include it in my post.

Didn't need that much info. I have been driving past that address for +35yrs, and I thought it strange. Just never thought of a 'field agent' for UL.

 

[hurk27]

Funny thing is, I have found a few of these receptacles over the years in old houses, most with only 2 prongs, at one time I found a Leviton one and looked it up on their web site from the numbers on the receptacle, there used to be an old thread on it but not sure if it was before the 2003 software change, so at one time they did install them:jawdrop:, more common today is the combo 15 or 20 amp 125/250 volt receptacle that is a duplex with one 250 volt and one 125 volt receptacle, I tried to search Leviton's web site but can not find the old one any more.

P.S. not sure if I ever found a grounding version but I do remember the non-grounding ones.