In ground pool bonding

[nizak]

I have a 20'x40' semi in ground pool that I need to bond.

The wall panels are fiberglass, the floor is a troweled concrete product, and it has a vinyl liner.

The support for the pool walls are( 22 )1.5"X 1.5"x .187 aluminum angles that bolt to the fiberglass walls and extend down into a concrete encased pad.( Will be covered in backfill when completed)

The individual angles are not connected to one another in any way.

I get to the job and the installer (from downstate) tells me that I don't need to bond to each support just 1 on each side and one on each end.

" Hit four points with the #8 and take it back to the equipment pad" is what he tells me.

I tell him all metallic components over 4" need bonding and he laughs at me.

I ask if the apron will have wire mesh in the pour, he says no.

I tell him there needs to be a perimeter bond wire around the pool under the apron and he says "his" electrician never does it.

He says he can't even recall how many pools he's done this way and never failed an inspection.

Am I totally mis interpreting the code?

 

[Craigv]

I have a 20'x40' semi in ground pool that I need to bond.

The wall panels are fiberglass, the floor is a troweled concrete product, and it has a vinyl liner.

The support for the pool walls are( 22 )1.5"X 1.5"x .187 aluminum angles that bolt to the fiberglass walls and extend down into a concrete encased pad.( Will be covered in backfill when completed)

The individual angles are not connected to one another in any way.

I get to the job and the installer (from downstate) tells me that I don't need to bond to each support just 1 on each side and one on each end.

" Hit four points with the #8 and take it back to the equipment pad" is what he tells me.

I tell him all metallic components over 4" need bonding and he laughs at me.

I ask if the apron will have wire mesh in the pour, he says no.

I tell him there needs to be a perimeter bond wire around the pool under the apron and he says "his" electrician never does it.

He says he can't even recall how many pools he's done this way and never failed an inspection.

Am I totally mis interpreting the code?

Nope. While there may still be AHJ's with really old code cycles before equipotential bonding was enacted, I don't think the "hit four corners" thing ever applied to separate unconnected metal supports. That approach was for above-ground pools and metal shell in-ground pools, which mostly had continuous metal all the way around, not for fg shells.

The fact that this unprofessional installer doesn't bother reinforcing a concrete slab speaks volumes about where his priorities lie.

 

[blkmagik21]

The way I read it, you do not have to bond the supports. You have to hit the rebar in four points under the pool, but if their is a Support separated by a nonconductive surface IE fiberglass. (Liner alone doesn’t count) then it need not be bonded.


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[blkmagik21]

Note the exceptions and the 4” or larger refers to metal fittings that penetrate into the pool.


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[nizak]

(3) Metallic Components.

" Metallic parts of the pool, ..........., must be bonded to the equipotential grid"

 

[blkmagik21]

Exception No. 1: Where separated from the pool, outdoor spa, or outdoor hot tub structure by a permanent barrier.


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[nizak]

so then the fiberglass wall panels are acting as the permanent barrier?

 

[blkmagik21]

Yes, if they were metal then they would already be tied together with the metal supports. If they are plastic, same thing as fiberglass.


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[blkmagik21]

so then the fiberglass wall panels are acting as the permanent barrier?

That’s how I read it


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[nizak]

Thanks for the input.

Really have to go through the code with a fine tooth comb .

 

[blkmagik21]

In ground pool bonding

Thanks for the input.

Really have to go through the code with a fine tooth comb .

No problem man, and yea! Some codes send you from one chapter to another and then to another to get the rules. Don’t even get me started on load calculations.


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[Luis Couto]

Nope. While there may still be AHJ's with really old code cycles before equipotential bonding was enacted, I don't think the "hit four corners" thing ever applied to separate unconnected metal supports. That approach was for above-ground pools and metal shell in-ground pools, which mostly had continuous metal all the way around, not for fg shells.

The fact that this unprofessional installer doesn't bother reinforcing a concrete slab speaks volumes about where his priorities lie.

I love it!
Fiberglass is conductive

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[GoldDigger]

The way I read it, you do not have to bond the supports. You have to hit the rebar in four points under the pool, but if their is a Support separated by a nonconductive surface IE fiberglass. (Liner alone doesn’t count) then it need not be bonded.


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I would expect that the fasteners holding the metal angle to the fiberglass would extend through the fiberglass and sit under only the vinyl liner. If the fasteners are non-metallic, I would agree that all the angles might not need to be bonded.

 

[FionaZuppa]

what about a plastic ladder that has a small metal bracket screwed to the legs, the brackets are only used for helping hang ladder in storage. the brackets are in the water when ladder is in-use. does that need to be bonded? if so how do you do it?

 

[Craigv]

what about a plastic ladder that has a small metal bracket screwed to the legs, the brackets are only used for helping hang ladder in storage. the brackets are in the water when ladder is in-use. does that need to be bonded? if so how do you do it?

If the brackets are under 4 inches in each dimension, they don't need to be bonded.

 

[FionaZuppa]

If the brackets are under 4 inches in each dimension, they don't need to be bonded.

I assume you mean if any one dimension is longer than 4"?
They are 4.05" long x 0.25" wide and just 3/32" thick. These need to be bonded? for what reason?

 

[nizak]

Ladders and handrails are usually bonded by the #8 solid copper wire that forms the equipotential grid.

Attachment is made via a lug that is attached to a cup that is poured in the apron.

 

[FionaZuppa]

Ladders and handrails are usually bonded by the #8 solid copper wire that forms the equipotential grid.

Attachment is made via a lug that is attached to a cup that is poured in the apron.

the ladder is 100% HDPE, only small metal plates are screwed in so the homeowner can hang ladder in pool house when not in use. how do i bond those metal pieces? and why the need to bond them?

 

[nizak]

Sorry. I missed your portion of the post that said plastic.

Since the water is bonded I would think those small 4"+ Metallic pieces would be covered

 

[Craigv]

I assume you mean if any one dimension is longer than 4"?
They are 4.05" long x 0.25" wide and just 3/32" thick. These need to be bonded? for what reason?

Yes, same meaning. Yes, the length would make it require bonding. For the same reason everything else gets bonded.

I'd get a different, all plastic ladder. Or an all-metal ladder that's easy to bond. Or let the inspector not see or measure the part. Bonding these miniscule parts is a PITA.