1953 Federal Pacific situation

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Esthy

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House built in 1953. Has 2 - 100 amps "indoor" Federal Pacific electric panels, one in each side of the house. Both have neutral and ground bonded at the panels. Each one has outside fuse 100 amps disconnects and below is the gutter (btw indoor type) that contains the conductors from the meter to those disconnects and that neutral and ground are bonded there as well with also the ground electric conductor AWG 6 that I assume goes to the water pipe. There is a "small subpanel" that was added at later time for the AC and the pool and this was illegally tap on one of the disconnects and this sub has also the neutral and ground bonded. Really a Jumbo Mumbo situation. Those panels are in a very good condition and there are no money to replace those. I will replace all switches and receptacles and add GFCI where needed as there are none. WHY, in 1953 they bonded in 3 locations the neutral and grounds (in 2 panels and the gutter)? Maybe those panels were treated as "service panels" but then why the bonding at the gutter? I have 9 pictures but for some reasons the forum doesn't allow to download them
 

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Esthy said:
House built in 1953. Has 2 - 100 amps "indoor" Federal Pacific electric panels, one in each side of the house. Both have neutral and ground bonded at the panels. Each one has outside fuse 100 amps disconnects and below is the gutter (btw indoor type) that contains the conductors from the meter to those disconnects and that neutral and ground are bonded there as well with also the ground electric conductor AWG 6 that I assume goes to the water pipe. There is a "small subpanel" that was added at later time for the AC and the pool and this was illegally tap on one of the disconnects and this sub has also the neutral and ground bonded. Really a Jumbo Mumbo situation. Those panels are in a very good condition and there are no money to replace those. I will replace all switches and receptacles and add GFCI where needed as there are none. WHY, in 1953 they bonded in 3 locations the neutral and grounds (in 2 panels and the gutter)? Maybe those panels were treated as "service panels" but then why the bonding at the gutter? I have 9 pictures but for some reasons the forum doesn't allow to download them
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Everyday is 'mumbo jumbo' for me in the 'land code forgot' Esthy

So , as always walking into these deals, my first thoughts are 'what were they thinking' ?

First sniff, multiple MBJ's w/in the same structure , because they were probably too lazy to refeed and sub out all the existing old news

~RJ~
 
RJ, I was 9 years old when that house was build, I am really curios why they did it in this way and why it passed inspection, there is documentation about, but why it surprised me? Because all panels, boxes, devices show a wonderful workmanship and this is why my question. I met with an electrical inspector and he was not able to tell me why. My apologies for my grammar and idiomatic expressions as I am not a native. thanks -
 
Sorry R.J, with the exception of the new sub for pool/AC, everything is original installation, of course 66 years take a toll on the system. I still don't know why Roger deleted the post and I think it was rude.
 
If you want to keep the FPE and want an eye opener, try running a cement mixer and a circular saw at the same time from one extension cord, under their own normal working load. If it trips you can call it good. If it just buzzes but it does not trip, I would note that to the owner.
 
Panels that old would be Federal "No Ark", not FPE. Many eons ago lived in a Spartan "Imperial Mansion" :D mobile home/trailer that had a Federal panel in it, the handles were not orange either.

BTW, those Spartan MH's were built by Spartan Aircraft, & had a aluminum skin like Airstream, & were pretty well built, & the Federal circuit breakers did trip on a fault/overload. Because of the "No Ark" branding, I would guess they might be a successor to Colt firearms electrical division.
 
Esthy said:
Sorry R.J, with the exception of the new sub for pool/AC, everything is original installation, of course 66 years take a toll on the system. I still don't know why Roger deleted the post and I think it was rude.
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Esthy, the deleted post had nothing to do with your thread or questions. We get "junk" like this and have to delete it. It is not rude to you as it has no bearing on your thread.
 
Esthy said:
... I still don't know why Roger deleted the post and I think it was rude.
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The deleted post was not yours, it was spam.
The photos in your second post did not show up, most likely because you made an error in posting them or attaching them. I looked at your original post, there were no attachments.

You should apologize to Roger for calling him rude.
:huh:
 
Those are the panels and are originals. Having hard time downloading photos
 

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Esthy, when did you start posting as meldaresearch?

Roger
 
Esthy said:
..Those panels are in a very good condition and there are no money to replace those. I will replace all switches and receptacles and add GFCI where needed as there are none..
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New panels won't repair defects with service bonding, as only a grounding bus can.

If built before 1960's, might be 2-wire cables without grounding or EGC bus in panels.

New devices won't fix service bonding, but will make you liable for all defects, especially after ignoring 406.4(D)(2)&(4) as most idiots do.
 
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ramsy said:
New panels won't repair defects with service bonding, as only a grounding bus can.

If built before 1960's, might be 2-wire cables without grounding or EGC bus in panels.

New devices won't fix service bonding, but will make you liable for all defects, especially after ignoring 406.4(D)(2)&(4) as most idiots do.
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Don't call people names for not ignoring unjust rules. Half of 406.4 should be ignored.
 
Hi Roger, (house is a 1963 not a 1953. I don't know who is meldaresearch. I had problem posting because I forgot that I posted as Esthy (my wife) but originally as Louis Duke, I don't know if it has to do with multiple licenses as I "think" that company is in WA and look like a marketing one. My post was for an opinion only, eventually I will replaced them as I would like to install the ARK - fault, as installing receptacles will trip even from walking and creating static with the carpet :) > Maybe you remember me, and my sincere apologies, but everyday is more confusing as the privacy is cero.
 

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mbrooke said:
Don't call people names for not ignoring unjust rules. Half of 406.4 should be ignored.
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Ignore at your pleasure.
While insurance may deny claims for cause, or negligence, most State License Boards are ill-equipped to prosecute Un/Licensed contractor negligence, or illegal activity.
 
ramsy said:
Ignore at your pleasure.
While insurance may deny claims for cause, or negligence, most State License Boards are ill-equipped to prosecute Un/Licensed contractor negligence, or illegal activity.
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Then can play King with one person, lets see they try that with the masses.
 
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