Boxes to be accessible

[dana1028]

I'm looking for a code section that requires a conduit body or box cover to be accessible outdoors.

Have a situation where there is large HVAC equipment shoved right up to a box and condulet....only about 3-4" clear - no way to access the cover or contents ...but it is outdoors.

I looked at 314.29 - but it talks about being accessible without removing any part of the building [not applicable here].

300.15(A) - The cover shall be accessible after installation - but it appears they are talking about the covers for wireways, multioutlet assemblies, gutters, raceways. It doesn't seem like the covers they are referring to are for condulets or boxes [just seems that way because of the way it is written].

Got any ideas? Thanx for any help.

 

[480sparky]

See the definition of Readily Accessible.

 

[benaround]

Dana, 2008 NEC, 314.29 , IMO says that the box with cover shall be installed so that you

can get to the wiring without tearing the house apart. Was it installed this way ? Did

someone block the access to the 'box' sometime down the road ? Where is the violation ?

Also, indoors or outdoors is not addressed in the NEC, the rule is for all boxes.

 

[dana1028]

See the definition of Readily Accessible.

Not relevant - covers are not required to be readily accessible.

 

[dana1028]

Dana, 2008 NEC, 314.29 , IMO says that the box with cover shall be installed so that you

can get to the wiring without tearing the house apart. Was it installed this way ? Did

someone block the access to the 'box' sometime down the road ? Where is the violation ?

Also, indoors or outdoors is not addressed in the NEC, the rule is for all boxes.

Brand new home. Conduit body and pull box were installed on the exterior of the garage for PV array associated conductors [pull box, conductors run under and across a slab to the house, up to the roof]. Later [after slab pour] the HVAC contractor installed his equipment up close to the garage exterior wall [also in proximity to service equipment].

So - after the condulet and pull box were installed [and 'readily' accessible] the HVAC contractor installed his equipment such that there is no access to the condulet or the pull box.

The language in 314.29 makes reference to an installation that would not require damage to the dwelling to access the pull box - and it was installed this way. Later the HVAC contractor removed that access; there is no language that says you don't have to remove substantial HVAC equipment.

I just thought there might be something that says the box/covers must remain accessible but I can't find such language. [We're talking about substantial cost to moving this HVAC equipment...I was hoping for some language that is quite cut & dried so to speak; and I don't think the language in 314.29 or 300.15(A) provides such.

 

[throttlebody]

Accessible without removing the building finish is the key. HVAC equipment is not a building finish, but an accessory. Don't like it, but nothing to address that. Much like a wall oven with a junction behind it. The wall oven is not a finish, but an accessory, it can be removed, making the junction box servicible.

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

I would say that AC is a stucture and needs to be moved. If you cant win with logic then call the inspector.

 

[Rockyd]

Agre with Jim on this one! Look up structure in definitions of the 08 NEC.

 

[4SPARKS]

"Structure. That which is built or constructed."
Not the set in stone wording your looking for but I'd agree that A/C unit is part of the building structure. Also you said it was close to the service as well if its within 3 feet than you have some more ground to stand on.

 

[throttlebody]

So what you folks are saying is that a piece of manufactured equipment on a plastic pad is a structure?

 

[4SPARKS]

The same as a hot water tank would be in a basement if it were installed in the way of an electrical fitting that required access I think an argument can be made that it exists as part of the "structure". Mainly because its not as simple as pulling unit out of the way.

 

[480sparky]

So what you folks are saying is that a piece of manufactured equipment on a plastic pad is a structure?

From Art. 100:

Structure. That which is built or constructed.

 

[neal]

reply to thread

reply to thread

I would like to post a new question and can't figure out how to get started.

 

[throttlebody]

I know the definition and where to find it, thank you. For a piece of Listed electrical equipment to actually BE a structure is a problem. I was just thinking about all these HD tv's hanging on the walls, covering the receptacle outlets they're plugged into. They would be structures too and therefore a violation. This even goes without say that if you have an access panel with box behind it, would be a violation too, just by having to remove the panel, which is constructed, so it becomes a structure. I could go on almost infinitely, but I am just making a point, but maybe this is being read into way too far.

I do believe the OP has a bad situation, but not a violation.

 

[480sparky]

I would like to post a new question and can't figure out how to get started.

Choose the forum most appropriate to the question, then click on

 

[benaround]

Dana, IMO, The HVAC unit would be part of the dwelling unit as it is needed to provide

complete and independant living facilities, even more if heat and ac combo.

The HVAC contractor should know better than to block access to your boxes, etc., 50%

of thier work is electrical. Refuse to wire the unit unless they give you access to your stuff.

 

[LarryFine]

Choose the forum most appropriate to the question, then click on

Oh, be a nice guy and give him one that works.

​

 

[M. D.]

I would say that AC is a structure and needs to be moved. If you cant win with logic then call the inspector.

So ,.. this is a structure,.. as in separate structure ,...as in grounding electrode system separate??

I can't say that I have ever created a grounding electrode system when wiring an outside A.C. condenser..

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

So ,.. this is a structure,.. as in separate structure ,...as in grounding electrode system separate??

I can't say that I have ever created a grounding electrode system when wiring an outside A.C. condenser..

I did not say it was seperate. It is attached to the main structure with copper lines and wire.

 

[M. D.]

I did not say it was separate. It is attached to the main structure with copper lines and wire.

An interesting distinction,.. so too many other types of separate structures ,...some even have water lines run to them