What do you tell your customer

[Sierrasparky]

Well I just got through lookin over a home a customer purchased. I got a call because a breakers keeps tripping.
What I found is over 20 amps load on a 15 amp circuit.
When I calculate all the recessed lights and the fixtures up I get well over the 15 amps. Was this legit the code cycle was 2002.

I remember years ago in a residence you were allowed to place as many outlets on a single circuit but you needed to calc the recessed at the capacity of the housing and trim.

Before I spout my mouth off that the electrician failed and screwed up would this scenario ever have been legit.

SS

 

[jeremysterling]

Um... use lower wattage lamps?

 

[ritelec]

I remember years ago in a residence you were allowed to place as many outlets on a single circuit but you needed to calc the recessed at the capacity of the housing and trim.

Always thought each receptacle was to be rated at 180va and yes the circuit was to be rated for the fixture housing (although I would also go 125% of the fixture housing load, to later learn from this great forum that that load does not have to be rated at 125% (residential), although I still do anyway).

 

[John120/240]

I say not allowed. How did the previous homeowner deal with this situation ? Did they know

that the breaker would trip with too much load and only turn on half of the lights at a time ?

 

[jeremysterling]

Yes, I would suggest telling the customer to use lower wattage lamps.

But now I see your second question about calculating the load on that circuit using the max wattage of the luminaires. I do not know the answer to that question. Seems like a reasonable starting place but I've never heard of it being required.

 

[C3PO]

Have you measured the actual load on the circuit when it trips?

 

[Sierrasparky]

ampprobe says 20.2

 

[C3PO]

ampprobe says 20.2

Wow. If the fixtures have bulbs in them that are rated no high then the max allowed, then yes I would tell them that it wasn't orginally installed properly.

 

[Sierrasparky]

Nope none of the lamps are over. The idiot EC does not no math or does not care.
I always heard of a EC getting pissed off and placing the entire lights on one CB

 

[celtic]

Always thought each receptacle was to be rated at 180va ....

That is for non-dwelling units ~ 220.14(I)

 

[celtic]

I say not allowed. How did the previous homeowner deal with this situation ? Did they know

that the breaker would trip with too much load and only turn on half of the lights at a time ?

I agree and have the same nagging questions

 

[Sierrasparky]

Can't tell you about the previous owner. I don't know if there was disclososure on this at closing. It really does not matter to me either way. The owner had some guests over and the thing tripped. Kinda obvious to me. 20 plus amps real time on a 15 amp cir. Nothing is new seems all original.

I guess the HO can throw a 30 amp breaker on it.

 

[jeremysterling]

I agree and have the same nagging questions

Exactly, like which 3-gang box with 3-way switches actually has 2 lighting circuits in it that accidentally had all the lights put all on one hot. I've seen that in switch boxes with two circuits and both neutrals tied together.

 

[celtic]

I guess the HO can throw a 30 amp breaker on it.

...on a #14 ?

 

[norcal]

I guess the HO can throw a 30 amp breaker on it.

...on a #14 ?

I take it tongue & cheek as that is a time honored DIY tradition to just "put a bigger breaker in" even though it's wrong.

 

[Sierrasparky]

I take it tongue & cheek as that is a time honored DIY tradition to just "put a bigger breaker in" even though it's wrong.

nothing i would never do. Ya never know what the HO will do once you leave. I was just a brought in to check this out by the realtor for the HO.

 

[hillbilly1]

Can't really blame the electrician, how many times have you had a customer buy huge light fixtures after the house is already wired? I have seen chandeliers that took a 15 or 20 amp circuit by theirselves. If this is just a bunch of 120 watt fixtures, then maybe some blame can be shared. Can the customer change some or all to cfl or led? That will reduce the load greatly.

 

[mjf]

did you open the panel? are there 2 circuit on 1 breaker? are there 2 circuits pigtailed to 1 breaker? is there a JB in the basement where the circuit can be split?

 

[Sierrasparky]

...on a #14 ?

did you open the panel? are there 2 circuit on 1 breaker? are there 2 circuits pigtailed to 1 breaker? is there a JB in the basement where the circuit can be split?

No to Doubled up, Fairly new home. Built in 2007.
The nearest panel is in great condition with spare spaces.
The lights are mixture of wall sconces , recessd and hanging, nothing out of the ordinary. Could be wired incorrectly in a box, IE open boxes in a the area.

 

[petersonra]

Just tell the HO the truth, and his options. I bet he opts for lower wattage bulbs, maybe a change to CFL is in order.