Water/ice machine

[Microwatt]

Installation of a counter top water/ice machine. Nameplate says min ckt ampacity 19.3 amps, max OCPD 25 amps. There is a J-box on the back of it for the attachment of a cord or other wiring method. Since it needs water it is located with-in 6 feet of a sink. There is already a 20 amp GFCI receptacle in place fed by a dedicated 20 amp breaker.

Is it legal to put 12/3 cord with a 20 amp plug on this machine and plug it into the GFCI receptacle?

Also, is a typical GFCI receptacle considred a single receptacle or is a duplex?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

A gfci receptacle is a duplex receptacle not a single receptacle according to art. 100 definition of receptacle.

If you connect this to a 25 amp circuit how will you connect it to a 15 or 20 amp recep. Look at 210.21(B)(2)

If you direct wire it then you will not need gfci protection.

 

[augie47]

It has been argued herte previously, but, the fact that your duplex GFCI is considered to be (2) outlets by most, then 210.21(B)(2) would not allow the 19.3 amp load.
If you protect a single outlet with a GFCI device, you could use that since the 25 amp is maximum.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

It has been argued herte previously, but, the fact that your duplex GFCI is considered to be (2) outlets by most, then 210.21(B)(2) would not allow the 19.3 amp load.
If you protect a single outlet with a GFCI device, you could use that since the 25 amp is maximum.

How can you use a 25 amp breaker on a 20 amp device? I would not suggest using a 20 amp OCPD

 

[renosteinke]

I would submit that the usual 'ampacity' rules do not apply here.

Rather, an ice machine, or even a refrigerator, is akin to an air conditioner, and air conditioner rules apply.

Most notably, the effect is that you have a much larger OCPD than the 'usual,' and you get to run smaller wire.

Nor would I consider this a 'continuous load.'

19.3 FLA is well within the 25 amps allowed #12 wire. The "*" in the ampacity table leads you to the code sections that explain this.

19.3-A is also within the limits of a 20-A device.

Breakers and devices are not sized for each other; they're sized for the loads. In this case, both are compliant.

 

[Microwatt]

Thanks for the replies. I was thinking it either has to be a 20 amp GFCI breaker to a 20 amp single receptacle via #12 wire. Might not be the best but I think it would be legal. Or, 30 amp receptacle fed by a 25 amp breaker via #10 wire. No GFCI protection provided with this option. Just to clairify, this is a 120 volt circuit.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

If you use a 25 amp breaker, there is no code reason to use a conductor larger than #12 for this application. In my opinion this equipment is within the scope of Article 440.

 

[Microwatt]

If you use a 25 amp breaker, there is no code reason to use a conductor larger than #12 for this application. In my opinion this equipment is within the scope of Article 440.

So 240.4 (D)(5) would not require me to go to #10 wire?

 

[augie47]

How can you use a 25 amp breaker on a 20 amp device? I would not suggest using a 20 amp OCPD

i did not make myself clear, apparently. He could, IMHO, use a 20 amp single outlet protected by a GFCI device (breaker, dead-front, etc). I only mention3d the 25 amp as it is maximum but not permissible on his 20 amp receptacle.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

So 240.4 (D)(5) would not require me to go to #10 wire?

Nope.........

 

[augie47]

If you use a 25 amp breaker, there is no code reason to use a conductor larger than #12 for this application. In my opinion this equipment is within the scope of Article 440.

I agree. However, he could not use the 20 amp receptacle, correct ?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I agree. However, he could not use the 20 amp receptacle, correct ?

That is my opinion - it would have to be direct wired.

 

[Microwatt]

Nope.........

Not even if it is cord and plug connected? If this ice machine were ever to go away there could be a 30 amp receptacle with 25 amps of capacity. The potential would be there to load the #12s to more than 20 amps.

Would you mind providing a code atricle or two?

 

[texie]

I think I'm with Dennis on this one. #12 wire, 25 amp breaker, hard wire. 440 applies.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

So 240.4 (D)(5) would not require me to go to #10 wire?

In my opinion, 240.4(G) and not 240.4(D) applies to this circuit.

 

[infinity]

Is there any condition where a 25 amp OCPD can be protecting a 20 amp receptacle?

 

[hurk27]

I think if you use a receptacle your not going to get around 210.21(B)(1)

B) Receptacles.
(1) Single Receptacle on an Individual Branch Circuit.
A single receptacle installed on an individual branch circuit
shall have an ampere rating not less than that of the branch
circuit.

Is this a dwelling or commercial?

 

[texie]

Is there any condition where a 25 amp OCPD can be protecting a 20 amp receptacle?

This is something I've always wrestled with. I don't think there is any condition where this is allowed. This often comes up with a motor load that is cord and plug connected.

 

[infinity]

This is something I've always wrestled with. I don't think there is any condition where this is allowed. This often comes up with a motor load that is cord and plug connected.

I agree. So he's either stuck with a 20 amp receptacle and a 20 amp OCPD or a 30 amp receptacle and a 25 amp OCPD.

 

[hurk27]

I don't see any allowance for a 20 amp receptacle to serve a 19.2 amp load, Table 210.21(B)(2) only allows a 16 amp load on a 20 amp receptacle, But I don't see anything that prevents a 30 amp receptacle on a 20 amp circuit, personly I would go with hard wired.