Question about 480 Volt Extension cord

[petersonra]

Somewhere the line has to be drawn as to whether or not it is temporary, subject to frequent interchange, or otherwise permitted to be cord and plug connected, and when such a cord is truly a substitute for permanent wiring. Then we can maybe determine what if any of art 400 applies. Temporary usually has time limits that go with it.


OSHA would only apply to places of employment, so if we are talking elsewhere - forget OSHA.

where does the code place any time limits on temporary except for holiday lighting?

given that the code section for temporary installations would seem to allow such an installation to remain in place indefinitely, I don't see any actual time limit.

 

[petersonra]

OSHA would only apply to places of employment, so if we are talking elsewhere - forget OSHA.

as far as code enforcement goes and the use of extension cords, it appears to me that at least some code inspectors are trying to enforce OSHA requirements that they have no business being involved in enforcing at all by making dubious claims about how extension cords are covered by the NEC in some way.

 

[iwire]

OSHA would only apply to places of employment, so if we are talking elsewhere - forget OSHA.

1) I doubt the OP needs a 480 volt cord for his home.

2) I did not say it applied anyway, I was using it as an example

3) The NEC only applies where it is adopted, so if we are talking elsewhere - forget The NEC. :roll:

 

[iwire]

I think we all agree that there is no length limit to an extension cord which is really what the OP asked.

As far as the rest, I stand by my opinion and the AHJ in the areas I work would roll with laughter if I told them the NEC does not apply to field made cords.

How do I know it will be a field made cord? I am assuming because having a 480 volt extension cord made by a factory is not how I see things done.

 

[ActionDave]

I think we all agree that there is no length limit to an extension cord which is really what the OP asked.

As far as the rest, I stand by my opinion and the AHJ in the areas I work would roll with laughter if I told them the NEC does not apply to field made cords.

How do I know it will be a field made cord? I am assuming because having a 480 volt extension cord made by a factory is not how I see things done.

So how is life in the real world treating you these days?

 

[petersonra]

I think we all agree that there is no length limit to an extension cord which is really what the OP asked.

As far as the rest, I stand by my opinion and the AHJ in the areas I work would roll with laughter if I told them the NEC does not apply to field made cords.

How do I know it will be a field made cord? I am assuming because having a 480 volt extension cord made by a factory is not how I see things done.

how is there any difference between a "field made" cord and a purchased one being used for the same purpose? how does one end up being subject to the NEC and not the other?

would it make any difference if it was made in a factory out of the same exact components? its is still the same cord.

 

[iwire]

So how is life in the real world treating you these days?

Thanks, I needed that.

 

[iwire]

how is there any difference between a "field made" cord and a purchased one being used for the same purpose? how does one end up being subject to the NEC and not the other?

would it make any difference if it was made in a factory out of the same exact components? its is still the same cord.

Listed assembly vs a bunch of parts.

The listed one has already gone through an approval process.

 

[petersonra]

Listed assembly vs a bunch of parts.

The listed one has already gone through an approval process.

are you suggesting that any assembly at all requires electrical inspector approval if it has wires in it?

 

[iwire]

are you suggesting that any assembly at all requires electrical inspector approval if it has wires in it?

I am saying that the NEC applies to extension cords made in the field from cords listed in article 400 and cord connectors listed in 406.

I am also saying I would love to bring you along to talk with one of my AHJs or even better one of our Fire Marshalls. They leave no room whatsoever for this abstract thinking.

Remove the cords or I close the building, call me when you are done. :lol:

 

[petersonra]

Remove the cords or I close the building, call me when you are done. :lol:

As long as they are allowed to abuse their authority it will continue.

 

[ggunn]

where does the code place any time limits on temporary except for holiday lighting?

There are time limits on holiday lighting? I used to string lights in the trees outside and take them down every year, but a few years ago (10?) I decided just to leave them up and replace the ones that go bad every year. A lot more of them survive year to year than did when I used to take them down.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

I am saying that the NEC applies to extension cords made in the field from cords listed in article 400 and cord connectors listed in 406. ...

And I am saying that if 400 applies (I don't agree that it does) to extension cords, then 400.20 prohibits the field construction of such cords.

 

[iwire]

And I am saying that if 400 applies (I don't agree that it does) to extension cords, then 400.20 prohibits the field construction of such cords.

400.20 Labels. Flexible cords shall be examined and tested at the factory and labeled before shipment.

The cord would have such labeling and testing.

I know you and a number of others hang their hat on 'installed' in article 90. I simply disagree as do many and the NEC is chock full of examples that support my view.

The precedent was set long ago.

 

[iwire]

As long as they are allowed to abuse their authority it will continue.

Facts not in evidence, you feel they are abusing their authority because you feel the rules do not apply to cords.

 

[petersonra]

Facts not in evidence, you feel they are abusing their authority because you feel the rules do not apply to cords.

they don't apply thus they are abusing their power.

 

[iwire]

they don't apply thus they are abusing their power.

That is your opinion, not a fact.

 

[petersonra]

That is your opinion, not a fact.

It is my opinion - thus it is a fact.

 

[iwire]

It is my opinion - thus it is a fact.

Fair enough.


Here is a pretty typical occurrence, we get hired to go to a store to add a bunch of receptacles.

Why?

Because either a fire marshal or electrical inspector was checking the store and finds a ton of extension cords supplying display items might be the TVs, or it might be seasonal displays etc.

The FM or EI will cite them on using cords as a substitute for permanent wiring. The store can either comply or if they stall long enough the FM will threaten them with closing the store. I wont say they close places often but it does happen enough store mangers get the message.

 

[jim dungar]

Remove the cords or I close the building, call me when you are done.

I agree, that as an AHJ, the Fire Marshall is likely to be the one calling into question the suitability of an extension cord.

Do they allow flexible cords, on vacuum cleaners, to be run through doorways by the cleaning crew?
What do they allow on a new construction site, once the walls are up and the only available power is being supplied by an outdoor 'temp pole'?