Where does wall measurement start on stairwell?

[GerryB]

I just finished a basement remodel and I was looking at the outlet I installed on the stair wall. So when you walk down the stairs or are standing in the basement room you have a full wall for half of the stairs and then it is open with a railing. I put one outlet in the wall. Measuring from the full side of the wall over it's about 5 feet, but if you measure from the bottom step over it is about 7'. It is really not a wall space. I guess my question is does the railing make it a wall? You could conceivably have a little table with a lamp on it if it was a few feet back from the bottom step. The inspector hasn't been there yet.

 

[Smart $]

Being you just finished it, I wouldn't fret over it. You'll have plenty of time to do that after the inspector leaves, if it actually comes to that.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

IMO there is no requirement for an outlet on the stair landing

 

[Strathead]

IMO there is no requirement for an outlet on the stair landing

I had to read the question again, but he isn't asking about a landing. He is asking about the wall extend from the stair treads to the lower floor of the stairs. I think it is an interesting question and I don't know the answer. I am going to have to guess that depending on the AHJ, one could argue that from the end of the stairs back is wall space, so the 7 feet the OP stated would be a violation.

 

[gadfly56]

This sounds like the perfect situation for a Mike Holt graphic. I did a quick look and couldn't find one. Does anyone know if one is floating around?

 

[charlie b]

I will admit that I can't visualize what is being described. Can you post a sketch of the installation?

 

[north star]

= + = + =

To get an answer, ...one must go thru the steps of researching the applicable
codes & standards.

Since the OP involves a Residential application, then the Residential Code is
the 1st place to start........In the IRC, ...the term "wall" is defined by either
being a load bearing or non-load bearing wall..........Since the IRC does not
clearly define the term "wall", then by default, ...one could then go to the IBC
for additional clarity.

From the `12 IRC, Ch. 2 - Definitions, Section R201.3 - Terms defined in
other codes: "Where terms are not defined in this code, such terms shall have
meanings ascribed to them as in other code publications of the International
Code Council."

Section R201.4 - Terms not defined: "Where terms are not defined through
the methods authorized by this section, such terms shall have ordinarily accepted
meanings such as the context implies."


From the `12 IBC, Ch. 2 - Definitions: "WALL - A vertical element with a
horizontal length-to-thickness ratio greater than three, used to enclose space."

That definition does not state "fully enclose" or "partially enclose", ...it just states
"enclose"........So, by definition, I would say that you have a wall with railing attached.


+ = + = +

 

[jumper]

I will admit that I can't visualize what is being described. Can you post a sketch of the installation?

Ditto.

 

[GerryB]

So here it is if it goes through. If not picture the typical basement stairs, if you are standing in the basement room looking at the stairs there is a full wal lon half the stairwell and then you see the open stairs the last half, in this case with a railing on it. So I am asking does the wall start at the bottom step with 1 inch of sheetrock

 

[Hendrix]

IMO you have a 12' wall. So, I would put one smack dab in the middle and call it a day.

 

[north star]

& & &

"So I am asking does the wall start at the bottom step with 1 inch of sheetrock"

IMO, ...Yes, you have a partially enclosed area of a wall.

& & &

 

[Dennis Alwon]

IMO you have a 12' wall. So, I would put one smack dab in the middle and call it a day.

I agree but I would probably install 2 receptacles- one toward each end

 

[iwire]

So here it is if it goes through. If not picture the typical basement stairs, if you are standing in the basement room looking at the stairs there is a full wal lon half the stairwell and then you see the open stairs the last half, in this case with a railing on it. So I am asking does the wall start at the bottom step with 1 inch of sheetrock

Is it a habitable room in the basement?

 

[GerryB]

Is it a habitable room in the basement?

Yep, that's what the job was, finish the basement. I just missed it but we'll see if the inspector says anything.

 

[JDB3]

Strictly by the code, yes, it is a 12 foot wall. By common sense, I would say you did OK.

 

[mjf]

Strictly by the code, yes, it is a 12 foot wall. By common sense, I would say you did OK.

Disagree.....receptacle required within 6 feet of the opening on either side of where the stairs enter the basement room (just like a doorway). Or if the stairs come straight down you still need a receptacle within 6 feet of either side of where you enter the room.

 

[GerryB]

Disagree.....receptacle required within 6 feet of the opening on either side of where the stairs enter the basement room (just like a doorway). Or if the stairs come straight down you still need a receptacle within 6 feet of either side of where you enter the room.

As I said I did miss the measurement during the rough, but we have had a final inspection and nothing was said by the inspector.

 

[scook56]

Bsmnt. wall

Bsmnt. wall

:thumbsup:
One rcpt. middle of wall. Client usage: <1.
Is it a basement or a cellar :lol:

 

[north star]

+ ~ +

"As I said I did miss the measurement during the rough, but we have had a final inspection and nothing was said by the inspector."

IMO, ...whether or not the Inspector caught the violation or not,
you are still responsible to have a [ code ] compliant installation.

Again, IMO, ...this type of workmanship practice "might" set a
precedence in one's mind to not install to code.......I do not
believe that "intent" is enforceable [ i.e. - 2 wall receptacles
should have been installed. ].

+ ~ +

 

[gadfly56]

:thumbsup:
One rcpt. middle of wall. Client usage: <1.
Is it a basement or a cellar :lol:

Don't laugh; in NYC it makes a difference. I forget what the difference is, but don't put on the permit you're renovating a cellar and it's really a basement. They'll bounce the application. In NJ no one seems to care.