Crimper for ground wire ”help”

N

new-master

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Location
MARYLAND
Occupation
ELECTRICIAN
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Need help, I have no experienced with permanent crimps,
Inspector has asked me that I need to permanently crimp my ufer ground ( concrete encase electrode) 4awg bear copper solid, for the the service that’s going to my disconnects, and does not want split nuts for it,
-What’s the correct crimp tool and dies information, I haven’t been to find any clear information to educate my self on this topic
Or this is buying the same brand crimp tool and crimp connectors?
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I see tools like this on Amazon but I not sure if this tool if use with the c-tap connector

Any info is greatly appreciated
 
ActionDave said:
Something like this is what I use
K425BG.jpg
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Me too, just mine is red. I like that green color 💚. What crimps to you use? I usually use the Blackburn CF series like a CF22, but I think you need to go up from a BG die to a KK to do like 2 #4. I've never bought the KK die as the BG seems to work even for the larger ones and I don't really care cuz it's all just for show anyway.
 
Most those C taps I've encountered use the same 5/8 die that "insulinks" use from a tool like the one ActionDave posted.

AFAIK most of them are not listed for grounding so keep that in mind. They can still be used for connecting bonding jumpers to a GEC though but to splice a GEC they need to be listed for grounding, something tells me the ones actually listed for grounding need a different crimper/die though I never encountered one.
 
Where is the irreversible crimp supposed to go?

Excuse my ignorance, but I always get 30’ of #4 bare and wire it to a piece of rebar in the footing. I started doing that because I didn’t want to deal with the crimp issue.
 
Seven-Delta-FortyOne said:
Where is the irreversible crimp supposed to go?

Excuse my ignorance, but I always get 30’ of #4 bare and wire it to a piece of rebar in the footing. I started doing that because I didn’t want to deal with the crimp issue.
Click to expand...

It’s a 400 amp split service two 200 A disconnect side by side coming out of 400amp meter box

At the moment I have The number 4awg copper solid going into the first service disconnect, that comes from the footing and from there i have a jumper going to a second service disconnect 200amp
But the Inspector wants that jumper that goes to the second disconnect permanently crimp to the footing ground outside the disconnects.
I already have them bonded in the lugs into the disconnects


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
new-master said:
It’s a 400 amp split service two 200 A disconnect side by side coming out of 400amp meter box

At the moment I have The number 4awg copper solid going into the first service disconnect, that comes from the footing and from there i have a jumper going to a second service disconnect 200amp
But the Inspector wants that jumper that goes to the second disconnect permanently crimp to the footing ground outside the disconnects.
I already have them bonded in the lugs into the disconnects


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
The inspect is wrong. 250.64(D)(1)
 
Seven-Delta-FortyOne said:
Where is the irreversible crimp supposed to go?

Excuse my ignorance, but I always get 30’ of #4 bare and wire it to a piece of rebar in the footing. I started doing that because I didn’t want to deal with the crimp issue.
Click to expand...
The only thing that is required to be irreversibly crimped is the grounding electric conductor. Grounding electrode conductor taps for multiple service disconnects are not required to be irreversible. The connection to the electrode is not required to be irreversible.
 
When I do need to splice a GEC, I use copper C-taps and a hydraulic crimper, but they do make a manual version which I also own.

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new-master said:
Inspector has asked me that I need to permanently crimp my ufer ground ( concrete encase electrode) 4awg bear copper solid, for the the service that’s going to my disconnects, and does not want split nuts for it,
-What’s the correct crimp tool and dies information, I haven’t been to find any clear information to educate my self on this topic
Click to expand...
As EF stated barring a local amendment the inspector is incorrect. A split bolt is code complaint for a bonding jumper. Ask for a code reference where the irreversible connection is required in the NEC.
 
busman said:
When I do need to splice a GEC, I use copper C-taps and a hydraulic crimper, but they do make a manual version which I also own.

View attachment 2576653
View attachment 2576654
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OK. So always learning. Turns out the crimp I posted is not listed as Grounding and Bonding. The two Code sections I could find that require that listing are splicing the GEC and GEC taps. I did find a ton of Ilsco crimps that meet UL467.


And it looks like the crimp with dies on a Manual Crimper (like the Greenlee one shown earlier). I have one Greenlee version and a way older Burndy one with wood handles.

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Mark
 
busman said:
OK. So always learning. Turns out the crimp I posted is not listed as Grounding and Bonding. The two Code sections I could find that require that listing are splicing the GEC and GEC taps. I did find a ton of Ilsco crimps that meet UL467.


And it looks like the crimp with dies on a Manual Crimper (like the Greenlee one shown earlier). I have one Greenlee version and a way older Burndy one with wood handles.

View attachment 2576714

Mark
Click to expand...
I remember looking up this kind of information some time ago, Yes there are devices listed for grounding, that my supply house doesn't stock which tells me there is either nobody using them for such or nobody actually enforcing use of the proper devices. The ones they did carry do call for dies O or BG like what you mentioned and I have that crimper. But at the time I was investigating this I couldn't find any listed for grounding that you can use those dies on. I think I was looking at Burndy then as that is what I use for other such crimp on devices that this tool can use.
 
kwired said:
I remember looking up this kind of information some time ago, Yes there are devices listed for grounding, that my supply house doesn't stock which tells me there is either nobody using them for such or nobody actually enforcing use of the proper devices. The ones they did carry do call for dies O or BG like what you mentioned and I have that crimper. But at the time I was investigating this I couldn't find any listed for grounding that you can use those dies on. I think I was looking at Burndy then as that is what I use for other such crimp on devices that this tool can use.
Click to expand...
Amazingly (at least to me) you can get these on Amazon. With that said, I'm not going to stay up at night about using T&B C-taps I showed earlier.


Mark
 
kwired said:
Batteries required - No
Batteries included - No
forgot to mention you need a crimp tool that may cost $400 or more.


also noticed first available date is about a month out.
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I didn't mention the crimp tool as I thought that was rather cheap given the 2K to 8K cost of a hydraulic crimper. The battery thing is funny. Mine is showing Tuesday (2-day) delivery.

Mark
 
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