AFCI

jim dungar said:
No. They are not designed to require replacement.
GFCI have been working for more than 50 years. As others have pointed out the GF issues have almost all been caused by changes in the loads. Why don't the appliance manufacturers need to change their products to work with our infrastructure?
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They keep adding more places that require GFCI protection, some involving things that never had to meet such strict leakage standards in the past making them not compatible with GFCI's.
 
kwired said:
The manufacturers have essentially bought the code making panels. They spend a lot of $$ with papers, demonstrations, etc. that are tailored to show things that favor using their product. You can bet they never show or talk about any product shortcomings, downsides, etc. even if they are aware of them when making any kind of presentation for the CMP's to see.
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They didn't just buy the code making panels. The Code seminar I just took a week ago had a Square D, Siemens and Eaton reps for speakers. All three of those reps are on code making panels
 
suemarkp said:
He's probably trying to be practical. I had an AFCI on a kitchen circuit that worked fine until I got a new refrigerator (I think it has a VFD type compressor). The AFCI would trip every few months. I since replaced it with a non AFCI. It is still GFCI protected which seems to be OK with the new fridge, but not AFCI. I could buy a new AFCI, but at $70 a pop I hate to replace it only to find it trips again in a few months.

The code doesn't support this, so sucks to be a new homeowner these days with the code getting ahead of what actually works.
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if we're going to follow the NEC, we must follow it's very first code article, article 90 - PRACTICAL SAFEGUARDING.
 
ActionDave said:
GFPE or RCD protection fills that place in my limited ability to articulate my thoughts.
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My problem is with the people that refer to AFCIs and GFCIs as being equals and RCDs as something special. The reality is it is AFCIs that are the special animals that don't live up to their promise.
 
jim dungar said:
My problem is with the people that refer to AFCIs and GFCIs as being equals and RCDs as something special. The reality is it is AFCIs that are the special animals that don't live up to their promise.
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Yes, there is that problem. There is confusion about what each technology does. This is compounded by some AFCI breakers having ground fault protection included and further compounded by not everyone knowing that GFCI protection is restricted to 5mA threshold.

If AFCIs could be removed, GFCIs kept in kitchens, bathrooms, and outdoors and GFPE/RCD protection expanded instead, we would be in a better place in the electrical world of North America. Who has to be killed or paid off to get this to happen?
 
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