10 Ground ran free air

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Pierre C Belarge said:
What follows is strictly my Opinion.

...I believe the reason we see no restriction on the method of installation for this conductor is, the panels are generally in the same room and usually installed close to each other.
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That may be true, Pierre, but i have seen where the panels were farther apart like in another rooom etc or down the hall like one guy said. Sometimes its extreme and on another floor.

I probably wouldn't have too much of an issue if it wasn't for some inspectors are not citing the nonplenum rated wire installed in these ceilings.

I'm curious as to how you read the wording of 250.102(E), just your opinion, not what is 'widely' practice. Do you think that 517.14 wording could be modified to say that section 250.102 does not apply?
 
raider1 said:
A big problem with trying to use 250.102 is that the title of 250.102 is "Equipment bonding jumpers". Nowhere in 517.14 is the conductor used to connect the the panelboards together refer to as an equipment bonding jumper.



Here is the definition of equipment bonding jumper.



I don't see where the conductor in 517.14 is part of the equipment grounding conductor.



That violation is already taken care of in the text of 517.14



If you feel this is an issue I would recommend submitting a proposal for the 2014 code.

Chris
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It says '2 or more portions of the egc' . I see connecting to the equipment grounding terminal as a 'portion' of the egc since the egc is terminated there, maybe this is a stretch for some.

I see only a 'part' of 517.14 violation being taken care of and that is the 'unspliced' requirment. Nothing is said about 'plenum' rated wire if it is run in a plenum celieing, which in my opinion is just as bad.

Maybe I will submit a code change proposal. ;)
 
brother said:
I see only a 'part' of 517.14 violation being taken care of and that is the 'unspliced' requirment. Nothing is said about 'plenum' rated wire if it is run in a plenum celieing, which in my opinion is just as bad.
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Chapter 1-3 are the general rules and are modified by the other chapters. It is redundant for article 517.14 to talk about plenum when it is covered in art. 300.22(C).

Why may I ask is plenum rated wire a bad idea-- that is it's purpose and is allowed by code the same as telephone and other cable is allowed in a plenum. I seriously doubt the #10 is plenum rated but who knows.
 
brother said:
That may be true, Pierre, but i have seen where the panels were farther apart like in another rooom etc or down the hall like one guy said. Sometimes its extreme and on another floor.

I probably wouldn't have too much of an issue if it wasn't for some inspectors are not citing the nonplenum rated wire installed in these ceilings.

I'm curious as to how you read the wording of 250.102(E), just your opinion, not what is 'widely' practice. Do you think that 517.14 wording could be modified to say that section 250.102 does not apply?
Click to expand...

Brother
Remember, anything I say is really just my opinion.

Another thought based on the portion of your post I highlighted.
As a user and person who discusses the NEC more than most, I have learned something about writing code.............It is very hard to do and do it well.
Another thing I have learned, is the CMP do not like to add unnecessary items to any code section.
Now MY OPINION. I think that some kind of direction as to installation procedure in regards to this conductor would help, even if it is reference to another section(s).
 
Dennis Alwon said:
Chapter 1-3 are the general rules and are modified by the other chapters. It is redundant for article 517.14 to talk about plenum when it is covered in art. 300.22(C).

Why may I ask is plenum rated wire a bad idea-- that is it's purpose and is allowed by code the same as telephone and other cable is allowed in a plenum. I seriously doubt the #10 is plenum rated but who knows.
Click to expand...

My previous typing was a typo. meant to say , 'non' plenum rated. ;) sorry for the confusion.
 
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