2008 Nec 314.27

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pjg

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We wired our first house with the 2008 code and I am having a hard time understanding why a pull chain(or any common residential fixture) needs to be installed on a 50lb rated box. I can't seem to find any relief from this code section. Does this really require a fan box in the attic or crawl space as well? What the ..? Or am I really confused.
 
pjg said:
We wired our first house with the 2008 code and I am having a hard time understanding why a pull chain(or any common residential fixture) needs to be installed on a 50lb rated box. I can't seem to find any relief from this code section. Does this really require a fan box in the attic or crawl space as well? What the ..? Or am I really confused.
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Because the next bozo that works on the electrical may not be smart enough to install a fan-rated box with he replaces the PC with a ceiling fan. :mad:
 
pjg said:
We wired our first house with the 2008 code and I am having a hard time understanding why a pull chain(or any common residential fixture) needs to be installed on a 50lb rated box. I can't seem to find any relief from this code section. Does this really require a fan box in the attic or crawl space as well? What the ..? Or am I really confused.
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You missed the exception.

NEC 2008 314.27(A) Outlet Boxes, Boxes at Luminaire Outlets.

Exception: A wall-mounted luminaire weighing not more than 6lbs shall be permitted to be supported on other boxes or plaster rings that are secured to other boxes, provided the luminaire or its supporting yoke is secured to the box with no fewer than two #6 or larger screws.

The code panels use of the word "shall" makes the exception mandatory as it relates to 90.5(A)
 
Also see NEC 2008 314.27(E) Outlet Boxes, Utilization Equipment

Exception: Utilization equipment weighing not more than 6 lbs shall be permitted to be supported on other boxes or plaster rings that are secured to other boxes, provided the equipment or its supporting yoke is secured to the box with no fewer than two #6 or larger screws.
 
I should have mentioned the "wall "exception and I do understand the next guy hanging a fan on a plastic box. But what I dont' get is the uninhabitable, unfinished rooms or areas where this now requires a 50 lb rated box. and I guess I should not assume that a "Fan box" is required-just a 50lb rated box
 
pjg said:
I should have mentioned the "wall "exception and I do understand the next guy hanging a fan on a plastic box. But what I dont' get is the uninhabitable, unfinished rooms or areas where this now requires a 50 lb rated box. and I guess I should not assume that a "Fan box" is required-just a 50lb rated box
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I'm not sure where the reference is you are referring to in regards to "uninhabitable, unfinished rooms or areas". I didn't see it mentioned in 314.23. (But then again it's late and my eyes are tired.)

If it is uninhabitable or an unfinished room or areas, all that would be rewuired is a keyless fixture on a box rated for 6lbs as stated in both exceptions. I don't think the 50 lb box applies to these rooms.
 
"uninhabitable, unfinished rooms or areas". Those are my words. I think that would be a suggestion for a 2011 code change as an exception to the main rule

I don't see where the code(2008) will allow any box except a 50 lb rated box at a outlet intented for luminaire support in a ceiling, (maybe a better description would be "other than a wall mounted outlet intented for luminaire support") except for a smoke detector or other utilization equipment
 
The UL listing says that both metallic and nonmetallic outlet boxes that are used to support ceiling lighting fixtures must be marked on the shipping carton with the following words, "for fixture support". If the carton says this, then the box is suitable for supporting up to 50 pounds. This rule does not require the use of a "fan" rated box. That is a different type of box designed not only to support weight but also to handle the dynamic loads from the moving fan.
QCIT.GuideInfo Metallic Outlet Boxes
 QCMZ.GuideInfo Nonmetallic Outlet Boxes
 
I have seen a fan rated box that is suitable for fixtures at 50 lbs but the same box is only rated 35 lbs for fans. :confused: I guess because of the wiggle factor.:grin:
 
Dennis Alwon said:
I have seen a fan rated box that is suitable for fixtures at 50 lbs but the same box is only rated 35 lbs for fans. :confused: I guess because of the wiggle factor.:grin:
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I've noticed that also. And I have also held two boxes, one rated at 50 pounds, required for fixtures in the 2008. The other fan rated and listed for 35 pounds. I found that kind of curious. I could not find anywhere on the package of the 50 pound fixture ceiling boxes to allow me to hang a fan from it. So I am definitely confused.
 
the carlon nonmetalic boxes b520a, b620dc, b620h, b620c all say they are rated to support fixture to 50 lbs. on there web page. also the 620l
 
Dennis Alwon said:
I have seen a fan rated box that is suitable for fixtures at 50 lbs but the same box is only rated 35 lbs for fans. :confused: I guess because of the wiggle factor.:grin:
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jrclen said:
I've noticed that also. And I have also held two boxes, one rated at 50 pounds, required for fixtures in the 2008. The other fan rated and listed for 35 pounds. I found that kind of curious. I could not find anywhere on the package of the 50 pound fixture ceiling boxes to allow me to hang a fan from it. So I am definitely confused.
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I suspect that is is the 'wiggle factor" as Dennis put it. A fixture will just basically hang there, whereas the fan has vibration and starting torque as well.
 
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