25 amp breaker????!

[jimwalker]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

Ok will that 12-2 on a 50 amp breaker trip ?
Once in a pinch when the 20 went bad i used one leg of a 50 amp. This was on a T pole about 200 feet from the house and used as temp power terminated on a duplex recepticle.It was being used on a motor (skill saw)well it some how got a short in the NM and flames ran up and down the 200 feet till it burned free. Had this been in the house it would have been 911
I for 1 would not fuse #14 over 15 amps or a #12 over 20 maybe 25

 

[hurk27]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

Jim I can see that happing on 200' of 12/2 It would be amazing that the skill saw even ran at that amount of voltage drop. and I don't think any A/C unit would ether. I don't think a good electrican would allow any motor circuit to reach more than 3% drop as it can cause motor starting problems big time. But when the A/C unit is close to the panel it would have triped the breaker as the resistance of the wire would of been much less.

 

[binney]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

We do a lot of model houses, and the one that comes to mind has a condesing unit with a Min. Cir. Ampacity of 18 amps and a Max. breaker size of 25 amps. I always run a 14-2 romex and put a CH225 breaker in. Wether or not this will trip the breaker, ask my helper who forgot to turn the breaker off before cutting the wire. The breaker did trip, but not before it fried his stripper.

 

[hurk27]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

Here is another example: I use to use a starter button wired to a 120 volt pig-tail to trip breakers which allowed for faster marking of a panel or removing power on a circuit when doing repairs (I know some would frown on this) but it worked instead of running up and down stairs. but once in a while when I would trip a circuit that was a short run to the panel many times the 100 amp main would trip as well as the branch circuit breaker. this is because the AIC of both breakers was the same and the resistance of the wire was low enough to cause a current to be higher than the rateing of the main. with out harming the wire as it happens realy fast. I'll bet there are a few here that wondered if they had a weak main when this happened, or a strong branch breaker.

 

[binney]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

I'm glad to see i'm not the only guy to tap 2 wires together to find a breaker.

Only in extreme situations. LOL

 

[jimwalker]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

Sure is a fast method to turn it off.
Used that method in a airplane hanger when we had to kill circuits.Was either do that or walk 500 feet to the panel,sometimes it took 15 seconds to trip.At some distance it would be imposible to trip a breaker if dead short at end.

 

[binney]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

I've also found that the old ITE breakers would weld themselves off before tripping. No matter what the distance. SCARY!

 

[bill addiss]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

Guys,

Haven't you heard of a Breaker Tracer?
If I was a Building owner and the Electrician was touching or grounding wires to trip breakers I'd be pretty upset.

Bill

 

[binney]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

I've heard of breaker tracers, I've got one in my garage. What a waste a money that POS was.
What kind do u use.

As far as the home owner, I've done it in my own house.

 

[bill addiss]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

As far as the home owner, I've done it in my own house.

That doesn't mean it's OK. Like I said, if you were doing it purposely in my building I'd be upset.

Bill

 

[hurk27]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

Sorry guy's I should of said I only used this in new construction as this method can kick up a can of worms in a old installation. it can cause connections to blow apart, cause an extreme unbalance on multi-wire circuits. and of course cause a breaker to weld it's contacts all of which I don't mind finding on a new install for QC purpose's . But it can be very damaging if used on circuits that you don't know how they were wired. I don't use it very much anymore as I now have breaker finders, circuit tracers, circuit loaders. and much more toys to do the same thing. Also you can blow a good GFCI this way and or a AFCI breaker. Also the one I made had a inline 30amp slow-blow fuse to prevent any wire damage if the breaker failed to open.

 

[a.wayne3@verizon.net]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

IWIRE why....I don`t like 14 ga. in a home.12 should be min.but that`s another debate.It may be allowed but the cost is so minimal.In 10 years when that compressor gets tired 14 ga. would have had its test and probably be really black by then.That`s why I always match my wire to my breaker size.As a baby electrician I worked in NYC on old apartment buildings.They were fed from the basement of 6 story buildings from a glass fuse.HR`s were as long as 200 ft then there were A/C`s lights and such on a 15a circuit.The insulation would frey and crumble the wire was black.Rewiring was not an option,I wonder how many of these buildings are still like that Just a thought

 

[hurk27]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

Allen
In old installations we know there were never enough circuits ran. and even in high rises the long runs should of been sized for the voltage drop. I sure resistance did the same thing back in the "30s" as it does today. But 20 amp circuit isn't always the answer and 30 amp circuits would only make things even more dangerous. 15 amp circuits is allot more safer if you run enough of them. The reason I say this is, even though we can control our manufactures here in the US we sometimes cant control what comes through our boarders. I have seen many lamps, extension cords, and even cheap hair dryers made in China, that will have small 20 or 22 awg wire cords on them instead of the minimum 18 awg. I don't know how these slip through and are allowed to be sold here but they seem to get through. While living here in a trailer park for a few years I have seen many fires that have been caused by this. A few years ago many trailer manufactures started to use only 20 amp circuits instead of installing more 15 amp circuits. this has cause some fires when a lamp shorts out with a 20 or even a 22 awg cord. look at some of the older Christmas lights the wires on them are very small. and people still use them. Of course this is my own belief but if you get a chance and you can find one of these old lamps or even a newer one that has this small cord try shorting one out on a 20 amp circuit. put it on a circuit with a little voltage drop and you will be shocked on how good it turns into a heating element.
This is just somthing to think about.

 

[a.wayne3@verizon.net]

Re: 25 amp breaker????!

Hurk I have to agree.But i8 still don`t like 14 ga.