3 and 4 way traveler colors

[Jaybone812]

Of course it does. I personally hardly ever use it and don't find it cost-effective. Are people buying and using 14-4 or 14/2/2 just so they can have a dead end 3-way?

And I mentioned 200.7(c) because if a dead end wasn’t allowed the code rule would not mention how to comply while doing it


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[James L]

Of course it does. I personally hardly ever use it and don't find it cost-effective. Are people buying and using 14-4 or 14/2/2 just so they can have a dead end 3-way?

I've rarely used a x/2/2 cable, but I could think of some times it could have been useful if I were adamant about having a neutral at the dead end

 

[electrofelon]

There are plenty of residential applications where 404.2(c) permits a dead end 3 way


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Plenty? Okay whatever word you want to use I'm not going to argue with you.

 

[Jaybone812]

Plenty? Okay whatever word you want to use I'm not going to argue with you.

Any large habitable room where the other 3 way is visible , you can dead end a 3 way , almost anytime you’re on the first floor and there’s an unfinished basement below you as long as framing allows future access and the same applies if there’s an unfinished attic above you and , a grounded conductor isn’t required at a switch box at all in a unfinished basement because it’s not a habitable space . I’d say that’s plenty of opportunities to install a switch looped 3 way


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[Dennis Alwon]

And I mentioned 200.7(c) because if a dead end wasn’t allowed the code rule would not mention how to comply while doing it


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The problem is that in one of the earlier codes there wasn't an exception for 3 ways.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Any large habitable room where the other 3 way is visible , you can dead end a 3 way , almost anytime you’re on the first floor and there’s an unfinished basement below you as long as framing allows future access and the same applies if there’s an unfinished attic above you and , a grounded conductor isn’t required at a switch box at all in a unfinished basement because it’s not a habitable space . I’d say that’s plenty of opportunities to install a switch looped 3 way


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I think the majority of the members here tend to feed one end and switch leg from the other end with 3 wire between switches.

 

[Jaybone812]

I think the majority of the members here tend to feed one end and switch leg from the other end with 3 wire between switches.

Agreed , And there’s nothing wrong with that . I avoid dead end switching as well unless doing it makes things allot easier because you never know where someone is gonna want to put a smart switch in the future , but that doesn’t mean there aren’t quite a few instances we can do it and be code compliant . To each their own right lol


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[ptonsparky]

I think the majority of the members here tend to feed one end and switch leg from the other end with 3 wire between switches.

Minority here. I haven't done a house in years. Three wire down from ceiling box to switch. Three wire to additional switches.

Lighting home runs almost always to ceiling box.

 

[LarryFine]

I would typically run 14-2 to every switch box, a second 14-2 with recolored white for travelers. Take the switch leg from whichever box is more convenient, and feed the hot at the other one.

In the case of the feed and light between switches, one 3-way gets red and black travelers, the other one gets (re-colored) white and black travelers. The required neutral means two 14-2s.

The reasons you feed with white are 1) the one white with blacks is a joint that would normally not be disturbed in the future, and 2) you avoid having two white wires supplying the light.

 

[Jaybone812]

The problem is that in one of the earlier codes there wasn't an exception for 3 ways.

True but I believe it’s been in there since 2014


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[Little Bill]

Minority here. I haven't done a house in years. Three wire down from ceiling box to switch. Three wire to additional switches.

Lighting home runs almost always to ceiling box.

Wiring hasn't been done that way here for 40 years. Exceptions would be commercial/industrial where you drop down from junction boxes.

 

[eds]

I’ll use a 14/2/2 on a dead end threeway, but I will also use it on standard three way switching if I want to take power from the switch leg box, or if a multiple gang box I need power in that box also.

 

[jamesboy123]

I actually just remembered that a neutral is supposed to be at the switches if not in EMT.
I can’t seem to find that in the code but I believe I read that a while back, if the switches do require a neutral then wouldn’t both the methods in discussion be a violation.

 

[ptonsparky]

I actually just remembered that a neutral is supposed to be at the switches if not in EMT.
I can’t seem to find that in the code but I believe I read that a while back, if the switches do require a neutral then wouldn’t both the methods in discussion be a violation.

See post #14

 

[kwired]

I've rarely used a x/2/2 cable, but I could think of some times it could have been useful if I were adamant about having a neutral at the dead end

Many times I have run two 14-2 between two switch boxes, one being travelers for a three way, the other being L1/L2 to supply additional switches or loads beyond the second box.

Two 14-2 cost less than one 14-2-2 even though you have one additional EGC in the mix. Or at least it used to, haven't checked pricing difference in some time.