410.24 (B)

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tempguy

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I have a building going up where the hallway lights were roughed in using octagonal concrete boxes. Now the owner bought LED canopy lights that only have a 3/4 threaded stub in the back. It seems to me under 410.24 that these lights cannot be installed at this location since they will conceal the jb and there in no access to the jb from the luminare, is there any code compliant way to install these fixture.
Thanks in advance.
 
tempguy said:
I have a building going up where the hallway lights were roughed in using octagonal concrete boxes. Now the owner bought LED canopy lights that only have a 3/4 threaded stub in the back. It seems to me under 410.24 that these lights cannot be installed at this location since they will conceal the jb and there in no access to the jb from the luminare, is there any code compliant way to install these fixture.
Thanks in advance.
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The classic workaround would be to mount the canopy lights next to the octagonal box, with a new box supported by driven anchors or whatever is necessary, and use approved surface wiring to get from the octagonal box to the canopy. Not at all elegant, but IMHO compliant.
 
tempguy said:
I have a building going up where the hallway lights were roughed in using octagonal concrete boxes. Now the owner bought LED canopy lights that only have a 3/4 threaded stub in the back. It seems to me under 410.24 that these lights cannot be installed at this location since they will conceal the jb and there in no access to the jb from the luminare, is there any code compliant way to install these fixture.
Thanks in advance.
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If the fixture is hung solely on the box no access is required with the fixture installed. If the fixture is fastened to the concrete then the box must be accessible after the fixture is installed.
 
iwire said:
:thumbsup:
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The fixture can be pendant mounted so if I install it with a short nipple and no support from concrete, then it is a compliant installation.
I get this is the result of the rule, but what was the intention or purpose of this rule?
 
tempguy said:
The fixture can be pendant mounted so if I install it with a short nipple and no support from concrete, then it is a compliant installation.
I get this is the result of the rule, but what was the intention or purpose of this rule?
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Many times large fixtures where mounted over boxes that where very difficult to remove. This made access to the box hard if you had to troubleshoot other circuits in the box of need to add wires in the conduits.
 
iwire said:
Many times large fixtures where mounted over boxes that where very difficult to remove. This made access to the box hard if you had to troubleshoot other circuits in the box of need to add wires in the conduits.
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Yep. Question: if you had to mount an 8' new fixture over an existing jbox, could you

a) cut/punch out the steel of the fixture the size of the box so the box is accessible, then remount the cover over the box or
b) bring all the box wires into the fixture thru the factory openings
c) ???

Ive run into this quite a bit on older work and never have found a great way to conceal the wiring while still having access. In the past Ive done "A" as the wires in the box arent long enough to go into the fixture, and pigtailing leaves the same violation.
 
Does the wording actually allow you bring the conductors into the fixture and make the box inaccessible?
 
infinity said:
Does the wording actually allow you bring the conductors into the fixture and make the box inaccessible?
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Not exactly... "...provide access to the wiring in the box".

So, no, it doesnt. That said, bringing the box wiring into the fixture is a heck of a lot more accessible than stuffed up into a box.

410.24 doesnt read that lights mounted to the structure over a jbox are in violation; it reads:

"designed not to be solely supported by the outlet box"

So, lights that ARE "designed" to be box supported, but ALSO secured to the structure, are not in violation of this section. Granted, it would be pretty impossible to argue an 8' light was "designed" to be supported by the box only, but if it were, is it in violation, even if the back isnt knocked out/cut away?
 
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