440v motor on 480v supply

drcampbell

Senior Member
That's only 9% higher than nameplate. Not only will most motors tolerate that, you won't have the full 480 volts at the motor after all the voltage drops accumulate.
 

tom baker

First Chief Moderator
Staff member
A motor for use on 480 is rated 460v. NEMA voltage tolerance is + - 5 % ( I think, it may be 10 %) the higher voltage can saturate the windings and increase amp draw.
 

LarryFine

Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
Plus, the higher voltage should lead to lower current and cooler running.
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
That's only 9% higher than nameplate. Not only will most motors tolerate that, you won't have the full 480 volts at the motor after all the voltage drops accumulate.
But you also have to take into account the tolerances on the 480V supply.
I wouldn't do it.
 

kwired

Electron manager
That's only 9% higher than nameplate. Not only will most motors tolerate that, you won't have the full 480 volts at the motor after all the voltage drops accumulate.
Here no load volts is often near 500.

This probably a cheap motor to begin with, best to save $$ for a better replacement than to spend it on transformation;)

Light duty use, may still run a long time.
 

kwired

Electron manager
And that on a 440V motor...................
Question is whether it truly is rated 440 volts, or is it intended to operate on 416 as well as 480? That does land about in the middle of that range.

Though places with 416 are usually 50 Hz so that idea isn't so good either.
 

Hv&Lv

Senior Member
our 277-480 tends to hover around 495-500V no load. That’s only 4% voltage rise, but it’s about 13% higher than the motors rating.

Depending on your situation and where you are, the transformer could have taps and you could get the voltage lowered by 2.5% if needed.
will it work? Sure. How long?

I would definitely check the no load voltage.


Here’s some data on that motor.
http://www.teco.com.tw/fa/ecatalogue_file/en/HighEfficiencyMotor-AEHL-AEUL0710.pdf
 

kwired

Electron manager
our 277-480 tends to hover around 495-500V no load. That’s only 4% voltage rise, but it’s about 13% higher than the motors rating.

Depending on your situation and where you are, the transformer could have taps and you could get the voltage lowered by 2.5% if needed.
will it work? Sure. How long?

I would definitely check the no load voltage.


Here’s some data on that motor.
http://www.teco.com.tw/fa/ecatalogue_file/en/HighEfficiencyMotor-AEHL-AEUL0710.pdf
From your link

Voltages - 220 V, 380 V, 400 V, 460 V or Daul Voltage.

I guess OP's is dual voltage with 220 being one of the two. Still possible this wasn't exactly intended to be used on 480 volts nominal, probably will work though but for how long?
 

Hv&Lv

Senior Member
From your link

Voltages - 220 V, 380 V, 400 V, 460 V or Daul Voltage.

I guess OP's is dual voltage with 220 being one of the two. Still possible this wasn't exactly intended to be used on 480 volts nominal, probably will work though but for how long?
My question exactly...
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
Question is whether it truly is rated 440 volts, or is it intended to operate on 416 as well as 480? That does land about in the middle of that range.

Though places with 416 are usually 50 Hz so that idea isn't so good either.
Actually, the EU zone is now "harmonised" at 400V, 50Hz.
 

powerpete69

Member
The answer is highly questionable. May want to consider using a 480V to 440V transformer with adjustable secondary taps. Looks like 25KVA would be correct size. Motors dislike it when you change their intended voltage.

Consider the cost of that transformer vs the cost of a new motor. If the cost of a new properly sized 480V motor is less then the cost of transformer, go ahead and try the 440V motor. If the 440V motor fails, install the new 480V motor.

If cost of transformer is less than the cost of a new 480V motor, go ahead and install the correct transformer and all should work well.
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
The answer is highly questionable. May want to consider using a 480V to 440V transformer with adjustable secondary taps. Looks like 25KVA would be correct size. Motors dislike it when you change their intended voltage.

Consider the cost of that transformer vs the cost of a new motor. If the cost of a new properly sized 480V motor is less then the cost of transformer, go ahead and try the 440V motor. If the 440V motor fails, install the new 480V motor.

If cost of transformer is less than the cost of a new 480V motor, go ahead and install the correct transformer and all should work well.
It isn't a big change in voltage nor do I see the need for electrical isolation. So, compared to the motor rating, the transformer would have a relatively low kVA rating.
But then you have installation costs for additional installation and cabling.
Get the right motor instead of faffing about. It isn't as if it is a big motor.

Just an aside, I have nothing against TECO. We have used their motors, most likely on pumping projects, and I have now recollection of any problems.
I spent eight months in Taiwan and sas lots of them. I believe Taiwan Electrical Manufacturing Company is how it was Anglicised.
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
I say yes, and likewise for the motor in the OP, as long as there is no frequency disparity.

We've discussed this before, but this is the first time there's been a won't-work bent about it.
If your 480V supply has a 5% tolerance it could be 504V.
Thus 14.5% above the 440V rating of the motor.
The TECO datasheet kindly provided by an earlier poster shows the motor voltage range as ±10%.
so would it work? Possibly.
Would it invalidate warranty? Probably.

Does it matter? Is it worth the risk?
Depends on the application.

A little vaguely related tale.
I was having a cup of tea in the electrician's shop in a paper mill. Typical hurry up and wait scenario. I noticed a notice on the wall.
"An hour of down time costs £4,700."
That was in December 1979.
 

LarryFine

Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
If your 480V supply has a 5% tolerance it could be 504V.
Thus 14.5% above the 440V rating of the motor.
What's your answer to a 110v motor on 120v, or a 220v motor on 240v, such as described in post #18?

I remember the forum having the collective opinion that the voltage "mismatch" is intentional and beneficial.
 

iceworm

Curmudgeon still using printed IEEE Color Books
drcampbell, post 3, pretty well nailed it. What is to lose? The motor won't sell for anything useful.

Connect it, run it under load, check the current. The magnetizing current will be a bit high. But if the motor is not heavily loaded, it will be fine.

If the current is over the nameplate, then consider doing something. It is a 1.0 SF motor, so set the overloads to 115%. If the overloads trip, Start looking for a new motor or a transformer

Price out the new motor and compare with a transformer. I've never seen a 480D/440Y transformer. SQD and Acme don't show any - probably a special order, which is never a good idea.
If you do decide on a transformer, consider getting a 480D/480Y with 2 - 2 1/2% taps up and down. Set 5% high, and connected to 480V will give 456V on the Wye secondary.

The motor starting current will sag the secondary voltage from the transformer impedance. Recommend getting a transformer rated at least 1.5 times the motor FLC - 45KVA, 30 kva is small.

Depending of the cost of the machinery, the price of a new motor (or the transformer) may send the customer into conniption fits.

good luck. Let us know how it comes out
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
drcampbell, post 3, pretty well nailed it. What is to lose? The motor won't sell for anything useful.

Connect it, run it under load, check the current. The magnetizing current will be a bit high. But if the motor is not heavily loaded, it will be fine.

If the current is over the nameplate, then consider doing something. It is a 1.0 SF motor, so set the overloads to 115%. If the overloads trip, Start looking for a new motor or a transformer

Price out the new motor and compare with a transformer. I've never seen a 480D/440Y transformer. SQD and Acme don't show any - probably a special order, which is never a good idea.
If you do decide on a transformer, consider getting a 480D/480Y with 2 - 2 1/2% taps up and down. Set 5% high, and connected to 480V will give 456V on the Wye secondary.

The motor starting current will sag the secondary voltage from the transformer impedance. Recommend getting a transformer rated at least 1.5 times the motor FLC - 45KVA, 30 kva is small.

Depending of the cost of the machinery, the price of a new motor (or the transformer) may send the customer into conniption fits.

good luck. Let us know how it comes out
Why not an auto transformer at a fraction of the size?
 

iceworm

Curmudgeon still using printed IEEE Color Books
Great idea. Got a spec for a COTS, available in the US?
Preferably one that uses US customary units (kBTU/hour) and not metric electricity (kVA)

I didn't see anything - not even a 3-pot BB that looked suitable

But, first - hook it up and run it under load - and if it doesn't overheat ......
.

.

.

.

Move on
 

iceworm

Curmudgeon still using printed IEEE Color Books
I'll take that to mean you didn't see one either.
(Deleted comment about SI measuring fuel consumption in mm^2)
 

drcampbell

Senior Member
kVA isn't metric.
How many metres in a volt or an amp??
It's SI.
A volt is a meter[SUP]2[/SUP] · kilogram · second[SUP]-3[/SUP] · Ampere[SUP]-1[/SUP].
https://www.nist.gov/pml/special-publication-811/nist-guide-si-chapter-4-two-classes-si-units-and-si-prefixes

"The ampere is that constant current which, if maintained in two straight parallel conductors of infinite length, of negligible circular cross section, and placed 1 meter apart in vacuum, would produce between these conductors a force equal to 2 × 10[SUP]−7[/SUP] newton per meter of length."
https://www.nist.gov/pml/special-publication-811/nist-guide-si-appendix-definitions-si-base-units

And a Volt·Amp is a meter[SUP]2[/SUP] · kilogram · second[SUP]-3[/SUP].
 

MAC702

Senior Member
Some things are worth being pedantic about. That ain't.

Thou shalt not use the commonly understood term "metric!" Thou shall use a French initialism instead! LOL.

Chalk it up to colloquialism, if you like. "Metric" is perfectly understood by EVERYONE. And many will know what you mean when you say "SI." Feel free. Stop "correcting" people about it.

God forbid we use any jargon, even if that is what you want to insist that's all it is.
 

iceworm

Curmudgeon still using printed IEEE Color Books
Uhhh ... My post 25 comment, "Preferably one that uses US customary units (kBTU/hour) and not metric electricity (kVA)", was supposed to be mild engineering humor poking fun about units.

Regardless, dr, MAC you are both right on target.
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
Uhhh ... My post 25 comment, "Preferably one that uses US customary units (kBTU/hour) and not metric electricity (kVA)", was supposed to be mild engineering humor poking fun about units.

Regardless, dr, MAC you are both right on target.
Yes, OK.
I'm an old bloke. I know the units, Imperial, CGS, MKS, and can do most of the conversions mentally. I know what an acre of land is is square yards, pints (of beer) and litres of milk.
It doesn't make any of them wrong. But SI is so much simpler.
 

Jraef

Moderator
Staff member
TECO motors made for use in North America are made at the old Westinghouse motor plant in Round Rock, Texas. Yes, the NEMA design specs for motors in North America is +-10% of the nominal nameplate voltage.

But that is not what this motor is, this one was made in Taiwan and given the Chinese writing on the plate, the IEC efficiency references and non-compliant voltages listed, it’s not a NEMA design motor, it’s an IEC designed motor with a new set of data points on the nameplate for using on 60Hz. Most likely with our typical line voltage swings, this motor will saturate, run hot and have a foreshortened lifespan, as well as possible giving you additional torque stresses on starting (unless you have a soft starter or VFD). That foreshortened lifespan might still be 5 years from now, it might be 5 months, there is no way of predicting.

But here’s the thing; they ALREADY OWN IT and it’s already mounted into the machine. In addition, finding, mounting, wiring and protecting a buck-boost transformer to buck the 480 down to 440 for this small of a machine is not likely worth the effort; there is no reasonable payback. So were it me, I would just hook it up, get whatever life they can out of it, and to minimize down time when it does fail, get all of the mounting and shaft details off of it to order a spare now so that it is waiting in the wings ready to swap out. Then take this one to a rewind shop and have it rewound as a 460V motor to keeps as the new spare (although at 25HP, it may not be worth it compared to just buying a new one).

Side note; IEC motors like this will require Class 10 overload protection and they have NO service factor, so pay attention to that in selecting the OL settings.
 
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myspark

Senior Member
Some things are worth being pedantic about. That ain't.

Thou shalt not use the commonly understood term "metric!" Thou shall use a French initialism instead! LOL.

Chalk it up to colloquialism, if you like. "Metric" is perfectly understood by EVERYONE. And many will know what you mean when you say "SI." Feel free. Stop "correcting" people about it.

God forbid we use any jargon, even if that is what you want to insist that's all it is.
Using SI is appropriate term and it is not colloquialism.

Metric is not often used in academia like it used to.

Although some consider colloquialism as a style. . . it is considered vulgar or incorrect. . . which SI is not.

Metric has been abrogated. . . it is an old school legacy.

The base unit of meter that defines unit of length is the coherent unit of volume.

In the context of wood (for firewood)-- metric-- the volume is referred to as: a cord of wood.

You may still keep it alive (metric) if you live in the boondocks where you purchase and use wood for cooking and heating.

SI is now the mainstream. . . in science and it is not colloquial.

And I agree with Bes, it is a YES for SI


It also means YES in Spanish.
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
TECO motors made for use in North America are made at the old Westinghouse motor plant in Round Rock, Texas. Yes, the NEMA design specs for motors in North America is +-10% of the nominal nameplate voltage.

But that is not what this motor is, this one was made in Taiwan and given the Chinese writing on the plate, the IEC efficiency references and non-compliant voltages listed, it’s not a NEMA design motor, it’s an IEC designed motor with a new set of data points on the nameplate for using on 60Hz. Most likely with our typical line voltage swings, this motor will saturate, run hot and have a foreshortened lifespan, as well as possible giving you additional torque stresses on starting (unless you have a soft starter or VFD). That foreshortened lifespan might still be 5 years from now, it might be 5 months, there is no way of predicting.

But here’s the thing; they ALREADY OWN IT and it’s already mounted into the machine. In addition, finding, mounting, wiring and protecting a buck-boost transformer to buck the 480 down to 440 for this small of a machine is not likely worth the effort; there is no reasonable payback. So were it me, I would just hook it up, get whatever life they can out of it, and to minimize down time when it does fail, get all of the mounting and shaft details off of it to order a spare now so that it is waiting in the wings ready to swap out. Then take this one to a rewind shop and have it rewound as a 460V motor to keeps as the new spare (although at 25HP, it may not be worth it compared to just buying a new one).

Side note; IEC motors like this will require Class 10 overload protection and they have NO service factor, so pay attention to that in selecting the OL settings.
Interesting. But IEC? The IEC would suggest for the European market but Europe is 50Hz and 400V.
I don't know any country that is 440V, 60Hz.

UK used to be 440V/250V but never 60Hz.

A puzzler
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
Using SI is appropriate term and it is not colloquialism.

Metric is not often used in academia like it used to.

Although some consider colloquialism as a style. . . it is considered vulgar or incorrect. . . which SI is not.

Metric has been abrogated. . . it is an old school legacy.

The base unit of meter that defines unit of length is the coherent unit of volume.

In the context of wood (for firewood)-- metric-- the volume is referred to as: a cord of wood.

You may still keep it alive (metric) if you live in the boondocks where you purchase and use wood for cooking and heating.

SI is now the mainstream. . . in science and it is not colloquial.

And I agree with Bes, it is a YES for SI


It also means YES in Spanish.
Thank you kindly, sir. People here (UK) still refer to their height in feet and inches and their weight in stones and pounds. If I tell someone that I weigh 75kg or that my jolly big dog is 40kg I get blank looks most of the time.

Go for a medical examination and it is all metres and kilograms.

The HUGE beast with the shiny coat...

 
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Russs57

Senior Member
No idea how hard it would be to find a 180MC frame motor in the states.

I know the Danfoss motors are dual rated 380-420 @ 50 hertz and 440-480 @ 60 hertz. But then I'd expect the KW to be 18.5 and 22.2. I'm no expert on motors but I think that would require a 12 lead motor.

I reckon I'd make a decision based on how difficult it would be to source a new motor vs cost of downtime.
 

iceworm

Curmudgeon still using printed IEEE Color Books
...

Although some consider colloquialism as a style. . . it is considered vulgar or incorrect. . . which SI is not.

...

The base unit of meter that defines unit of length is the coherent unit of volume.

...
(SLAP)
Well I have been put in my place. I don't recall the last time I was accused of being "vulgar" - "uncouth" regularly, but not vulgar.

I promise I will henceforth no longer use kBTUs/hour (apparent) to rate transformers. Moving forward, I will use kJoules/second (apparent)

And in the interest of harmony, I will no longer use gallons/mile for fuel consumption. I will now use mm^2 per 100,000.

The base unit of meter that defines unit of length is the coherent unit of volume.
Without accusing you of any in-appropriate, colloquialism, shouldn't that have been "metre"?



the worm
(turneth - and begins to dig
 

myspark

Senior Member
I didn't say it was.

Regardless, my point was clearly about insisting on correcting someone's terms.

I don't say luminaire, either.

Not everyone is rubbing elbows with academics. You are negating your statement when you say "chalk it up" to colloquialism. . .and now you are saying feel free because everyone knows it.

What grates in my ears is when you say "stop correcting".
Well. . . who are you?
 

myspark

Senior Member
(SLAP)
Well I have been put in my place. I don't recall the last time I was accused of being "vulgar" - "uncouth" regularly, but not vulgar.

I promise I will henceforth no longer use kBTUs/hour (apparent) to rate transformers. Moving forward, I will use kJoules/second (apparent)

And in the interest of harmony, I will no longer use gallons/mile for fuel consumption. I will now use mm^2 per 100,000.

Without accusing you of any in-appropriate, colloquialism, shouldn't that have been "metre"

the worm
(turneth - and begins to dig

When you are a "broomie" a resident of Birmingham, England, you say metre.. . when you are in the Bronx, you say meter.

Bronx - liter
Broomie- litre

Bronx-theater
Broomie-theatre

Bronx- center
Broomie- centre
 

iceworm

Curmudgeon still using printed IEEE Color Books
Okay, now that does sound like an in-appropriate, colloquialism and the examples you give sound no different than:
Birmingham - SI
Seattle - Metric
 

Jraef

Moderator
Staff member
Interesting. But IEC? The IEC would suggest for the European market but Europe is 50Hz and 400V.
I don't know any country that is 440V, 60Hz.

UK used to be 440V/250V but never 60Hz.

A puzzler
It’s not uncommon for motor manufacturers, especially Asian ones, to re-label their IEC 50Hz motors for dale here by simply putting our equivalent voltages as they would apply at 60 Hz. Unfortunately many of them misinterpret our standards because they read old literature or just ask someone else who doesn’t really know. 440V has not been a standard here for multiple decades, yet that idea persists.
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
Using SI is appropriate term and it is not colloquialism.

Metric is not often used in academia like it used to.

Although some consider colloquialism as a style. . . it is considered vulgar or incorrect. . . which SI is not.

Metric has been abrogated. . . it is an old school legacy.

The base unit of meter that defines unit of length is the coherent unit of volume.

In the context of wood (for firewood)-- metric-- the volume is referred to as: a cord of wood.

You may still keep it alive (metric) if you live in the boondocks where you purchase and use wood for cooking and heating.

SI is now the mainstream. . . in science and it is not colloquial.

And I agree with Bes, it is a YES for SI


It also means YES in Spanish.
Thank you, kindly!
 

MAC702

Senior Member
Not everyone is rubbing elbows with academics. You are negating your statement when you say "chalk it up" to colloquialism. . .and now you are saying feel free because everyone knows it.

What grates in my ears is when you say "stop correcting".
Well. . . who are you?
I think you misread my post, sir. I said feel free to chalk up the word "metric" to colloquialism or jargon, not the initialism "SI." In other words, everyone knew what was meant, and there was no need to "correct" someone for using a term everyone understood. Feel free to use the technically correct foreign initialism yourself, and others will use the term with which they are more accustomed. NO ONE IS WRONG. I learned both terms in school, and use both terms. We are allowed to be less technical. There are so many things worth correcting, and that's not one of them, especially when every opportunity is taken by some to be smug by "correcting" it.

Geez, even the American code book uses "metric designator" v "trade size". Let's get the errata sheet going. Let's be sure to correct everyone, every time, that says "fixture" even though we all know what they mean, and many people say it.

On topic, we've now established not to use a "110 V" motor on a nominal 120 V supply?
 

retirede

Senior Member
It’s not uncommon for motor manufacturers, especially Asian ones, to re-label their IEC 50Hz motors for dale here by simply putting our equivalent voltages as they would apply at 60 Hz. Unfortunately many of them misinterpret our standards because they read old literature or just ask someone else who doesn’t really know. 440V has not been a standard here for multiple decades, yet that idea persists.
My thoughts exactly. If the person in China responsible for translating the nameplate was aware of how motors are really labeled here, he would have put 460 on the nameplate. Same hardware inside!
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
On topic, we've now established not to use a "110 V" motor on a nominal 120 V supply?
Have we?
I've simply stated my view. I would not connect a motor to a supply voltage that was outside the tolerance limits set by the manufacturer.
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
My thoughts exactly. If the person in China responsible for translating the nameplate was aware of how motors are really labeled here, he would have put 460 on the nameplate. Same hardware inside!
I think Westinghouse/TECO would be aware.
 

myspark

Senior Member
The comment I posted was in response to the topic. See post #44.
How could that be off topic.?

What I've said was about SI vs Metric. All throughout this discussion, the reference to SI and Metric were carried through.
Sure there will be some words to prove one's point that doesn't make the other person comfortable.. .especialy if the upper hand seems elusive.

There are lessons that can be learned in the midst of all this.

If that is how you see it being "off-topic", then you should delete all posts that have semblance from other members that pertain to what I said.

I have copy of my posted comment. . . I will take this up further if I have to.

Why would correcting a "wrong" be off limit and allow that wrong to continue.

Can you please explain that?
 

iceworm

Curmudgeon still using printed IEEE Color Books
Girls -
It's time to let this go.
Post 25 was an engineering/math joke about units - not a slap at SI.
Similar to suggesting fuel consumption be measured in square millimeters/100

To make my position clear:
In the interest of the OP, I standby my post 23, including the rewrites from Jraef in post 34.

Run the motor. See how hot it gets. Nothing to lose.
 
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Besoeker3

Senior Member
Run the motor. See how hot it gets. Nothing to lose.
Downtime if/when the motor fails. I commented on that earlier in this thread.
The exchange rate at the time would have made it over $10k per hour.
Get the right motor for the job!!
 
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iceworm

Curmudgeon still using printed IEEE Color Books
Downtime if/when the motor fails. I commented on that earlier in this thread.
The exchange rate at the time would have made it over $10k per hour.
Get the right motor for the job!!
Yes, you did, in fact, quote a sign at a facility that has nothing to do with the client. (Unless you have a secret decoder ring shared with the OP.)

As I commented earlier in this thread, if it trips the 115% overload, get looking for a new motor/transformer.
My guess is the client is trying to save a few dollars - there is no sin there.

If so (adding to post 23):
If the motor is not heavily loaded and doesn't run hot - it will be fine. Run it.
If the motor does run hot - get a new one ordered. The existing motor is not worth much. Run to failure is not a bad option. I would keep the overloads set down (115%)
Unless, the motor does run hot enough to sizzle when you spit on it: Yeah, definitely get a new motor ordered. Seriously consider a 1.15SF.​
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
Yes, you did, in fact, quote a sign at a facility that has nothing to do with the client. (Unless you have a secret decoder ring shared with the OP.)
I'm simply suggesting that there could be a cost the user might face by using an unsuitable motor operating outside the nameplate limits. A cost that could potentially be far greater than purchasing the correct motor for the application.
 

ActionDave

Moderator
Staff member
I agree with the worm. I'd run the motor and see what happens next. The worst thing that could happen is the motor burns up and it causes the plant shut down two weeks before Christmas, everyone gets laid off, the local economy craters and nobody gets presents which causes emotional scaring in one of the children who becomes a serial killer as an adult, but by then no one will remember the motor had anything to do with it.
 

Jraef

Moderator
Staff member
That’s why I said they should immediately buy the replacement motor now, so that it can be swapped out quickly when this one bites it. Lord knows we have enough serial killers and mass shooters already...

By the way, the 110V analogy is not equivalent. Old motors built as 110V we’re still built to (what became) NEMA standards, so their tolerance for 120V is not generally an issue. But THIS motor was obviously NOT built to NEMA standards, it was designed by someone who either had no idea what NEMA standard voltage ratings are, or knew and didn’t care. Either way, I would not trust it to survive for long.

And given the time it might take to get a metric motor here (or modify the machine to accept a NEMA motor), the lost production time waiting to get this machine running the first time is also a factor. So again, it’s ALREADY installed; get what you can out of it and be prepared for the eventuality of failure.
 
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Besoeker3

Senior Member
That’s why I said they should immediately buy the replacement motor now, so that it can be swapped out quickly when this one bites it..
Doesn't that depend of how quickly it can be done and what the cost of his downtime is?
May cost less to avoid that situation in the first place.
 

retirede

Senior Member
Doesn't that depend of how quickly it can be done and what the cost of his downtime is?
May cost less to avoid that situation in the first place.
Yes. I would SCHEDULE replacement once the properly rated motor is on site at a convenient time (weekend or other plant shutdown) rather than wait for failure.
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
Yes. I would SCHEDULE replacement once the properly rated motor is on site at a convenient time (weekend or other plant shutdown) rather than wait for failure.
Yes. Good logical approach if I may say so. But what we don't know (or maybe I just missed it) is whether the 440V has already been installed and in operation.

If it hasn't, then I would go for the correct motor in the first place. It isn't as if we are talking about a very large, expensive machine.
 

Jraef

Moderator
Staff member
Yes. Good logical approach if I may say so. But what we don't know (or maybe I just missed it) is whether the 440V has already been installed and in operation.

If it hasn't, then I would go for the correct motor in the first place. It isn't as if we are talking about a very large, expensive machine.
OP said:
I've got a client with an industrial sized sifter with a 3 phase 440v volt motor,
He also had a picture of the nameplate. I took that to mean the sifter has arrived with the motor installed and he is being tasked with hooking it up.
 

Russs57

Senior Member
FWIW, looks like a 284T frame motor is very close in dimensions. If the Euro C stand for close coupled C face then they do offer a 284TC.


Take a look at a WEG 02518ST3QIE284TC-W22. It might be just what you need.
 

retirede

Senior Member
Yes. Good logical approach if I may say so. But what we don't know (or maybe I just missed it) is whether the 440V has already been installed and in operation.

If it hasn't, then I would go for the correct motor in the first place. It isn't as if we are talking about a very large, expensive machine.
My thinking is that I would not delay commissioning of the machine waiting for the correct motor.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Doesn't that depend of how quickly it can be done and what the cost of his downtime is?
May cost less to avoid that situation in the first place.
Cost of downtime should be a factor. Remember that cost may involve time for replacement to arrive and/or time to fabricate so some other replacement can be fitted.

If it is a critical machine in a process that runs daily that down time cost may be much more than if it is a machine that only gets occasional use.

Availability of standby/alternate machine or other methods of getting the job done can factor into the cost also.
 

mbrooke

Senior Member
I agree with the worm. I'd run the motor and see what happens next. The worst thing that could happen is the motor burns up and it causes the plant shut down two weeks before Christmas, everyone gets laid off, the local economy craters and nobody gets presents which causes emotional scaring in one of the children who becomes a serial killer as an adult, but by then no one will remember the motor had anything to do with it.
:lol::lol:

Though you are not far away from the truth, thats how things often happen in real life. Something small sets of a larger chain of events.
 

Besoeker3

Senior Member
He also had a picture of the nameplate. I took that to mean the sifter has arrived with the motor installed and he is being tasked with hooking it up.
Thank you for that, sir. Sometimes I miss things. So yes, it would infer that the machine with the motor is on site but not yet in operation. If that is the case Riterede may have the best approach. But order the right motor right away. That is, if you can get one that is easily mechanically interchangeable.

It sounds like this is a piece of plant that was bought second hand and the person responsible for making the purchase did not properly check the voltage compatibility for the new location.
 
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