50A 240V receptacle outdoors for EV charging

Status
Not open for further replies.
U

UBG

Member
Location
So Cal
Occupation
Electrician
A customer has requested a 50A 240V (NEMA 14-50) receptacle in an outdoor location for charging his new EV (Tesla Model S).

The "Mobile Connector" (aka cord) that ships with the Model S looks like this (click image for larger version):

bkgd_panel-outlet-0.jpg

Tesla has recommended that an RV outlet could be used.

de15f409-70ad-4fb5-82f6-4e7f206fab3c_400.jpg

406.8(B)(2)(a) requires a weatherproof-while-in-use enclosure in wet locations for unattended equipment, and while a typical right-angle RV plug would allow the cover of that type of enclosure to close completely while the plug was inserted, the Tesla connector seems like it would prop the cover partially open. Depending on the actual angle that the cover would rest at while in use, it might or might not be a problem for water intrusion...but I can't assess that until I actually plug the connector into the outlet. Even if it's not a problem in "real world use", a partially-open cover might not meet the manufactures requirements for use corresponding to its listing, and I'd rather not ignore those details.

I've seen an "improvised" solution to this problem (pic below was posted in this Tesla owner's forum) and while seeming pretty weatherproof when the cabinet door is closed, I don't think it's legal, for a few reasons. I'd like to know your opinions on WHY it IS, or is NOT, a legal install...and, could a version of this be done that would BE legal?

Thanks, I always appreciate all that I get from this forum...

tesla plug open cover.jpg
 
I think that if you used a type 3R enclosure with an open bottom it would be "legal" as long as any energized parts were 6 inches from the opening.
 
petersonra said:
I think that if you used a type 3R enclosure with an open bottom it would be "legal" as long as any energized parts were 6 inches from the opening.
Click to expand...

Interesting idea... does a bottomless 3R enclosure exist? Is there a particular code section that addresses the 6-inch clearance you mentioned? Thanks.
 
ron m said:
Interesting idea... does a bottomless 3R enclosure exist? Is there a particular code section that addresses the 6-inch clearance you mentioned? Thanks.
Click to expand...

The whole bottom does not have to be removed. Just enough room to get the cord in.

I think the 6 inches comes from UL.
 
petersonra said:
The whole bottom does not have to be removed. Just enough room to get the cord in.

I think the 6 inches comes from UL.
Click to expand...

I see...so, a version of the cabinet in the photo I posted above, but a hole larger than the notch that they provided?

BTW, I did find open bottom 3R cabinets, but they are "pad mount", and much larger than what I need.

The modification of the cabinet is one of my concerns. Obviously, we modify an enclosure when we cut KO's to connect conduit, or provide drainage holes etc., but the cord passing through an opening, small or large, is one of the concerns I had as far as Code issues are concerned. I actually like the idea of a smaller opening for the cord, rather than a larger one...it keeps out large critters, kid-fingers, etc. etc.

Abrasion of the cord against a small cut out is a part of that concern, although that can be mitigated by filing and/or bushing the opening...
 
While I was reading your post before I even saw the picture, that was the way I thought of doing it.

As long as you did a clean job and installed plastic edge protector around the cut, I don't see the problem. Bees making nests inside the enclosure might be an issue though.
 
Cow said:
While I was reading your post before I even saw the picture, that was the way I thought of doing it.

As long as you did a clean job and installed plastic edge protector around the cut, I don't see the problem. Bees making nests inside the enclosure might be an issue though.
Click to expand...

I like it better than the RV outlet for function and safety, it's just a little...uncommon. So if I do it that way, I want to be able to defend it if the AHJ doesn't like it. Here in LA, the AHJ's for single-family-dwellings are general inspectors who look at all trades, not electrical specialists.

Another "question mark" I had about the installation in the photo, code-wise, is the use of the NEMA 1 box+cover inside the cabinet. The interior of the cabinet is theoretically not a wet, or even damp location when the cover is closed, but it would be tough to make the argument that it's "indoors". Maybe a 3R box and cover should be used INSIDE the 3R cabinet, just for code compliance?
 
I don't see any reason to use a 3R box inside a 3R box. Using your reasoning we wouldn't be able to use 3R panels without having another 3R enclosure around them.
 
It appears as though there is an adapter that allows the cord to be plugged into the RV device that you posted a picture of. Does not the manufacturer of the vehicle have acces to or can tell you where to get a receptacle of that type? :?
 
There really should be a standard for all cars. I know there trying to do this , but things move to slow sometimes.
 
The Cooper B-Line can shown in the photo will function better then the RV power outlet because of the adapter, there is no way that cover will be able to close because of the space taken up by the adapter, the cover on the RV receptacle can only close w/ a right angle plug.
 
JDB3 said:
It appears as though there is an adapter that allows the cord to be plugged into the RV device that you posted a picture of. Does not the manufacturer of the vehicle have acces to or can tell you where to get a receptacle of that type? :?
Click to expand...

I've noticed that Tesla sells a variety of right angle adapters, BUT...the right-angle adapters seem to be only for the Roadster model (check out this page), and my customer is buying a Model S. The "connectors" (aka cords) are not the same for each model.

I'm not sure, but I don't think those Roadster adapters will fit on the cord for the Model S. I'm trying to get clarification on that from Tesla, but have been playing phone tag with the contact there who handles charging questions. BTW the adapters for the Models S cord look like this:

nema_14_50_1024x1024.jpg
 
Cow said:
I don't see any reason to use a 3R box inside a 3R box. Using your reasoning we wouldn't be able to use 3R panels without having another 3R enclosure around them.
Click to expand...

You're totally right. An outdoor 120V recept. that is flush-mounted in an exterior wall doesn't need a 3R box inside the wall, it just needs the right type of cover.
 
norcal said:
The Cooper B-Line can shown in the photo will function better then the RV power outlet because of the adapter, there is no way that cover will be able to close because of the space taken up by the adapter, the cover on the RV receptacle can only close w/ a right angle plug.
Click to expand...

I really like that approach, I think it will work well too...but I'm a worrier, and I tend to over-think/over-analyze things at times. I'm getting re-assured here so far; at least a couple people like it, and no one has replied with "that's a violation of XXX.z(A)(2)"
 
Just for my own knowledge, what about the other end of the "connector" ? Is it protected while plugged in?

Thanks.

D.
 
Dweeber said:
Just for my own knowledge, what about the other end of the "connector" ? Is it protected while plugged in?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure, but it seems that all EV cords/connectors are "smart", with proximity sensors built in that only allow the vehicle-end of the connector to be energized when it's attached to the vehicle.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top