#6 to rebar ground?

[donselec]

I've been trying to find this but can't. So far all the resi services I've installed on new homes have been 200A, this is a 150A, can I run a #6 to the rebar, or does it have to be #4. Using #1 AWG copper service conductor.
Thx.

 

[bphgravity]

Section 250.66 of the NEC. #6 AWG to the CEE will be sufficient.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I've been trying to find this but can't. So far all the resi services I've installed on new homes have been 200A, this is a 150A, can I run a #6 to the rebar, or does it have to be #4. Using #1 AWG copper service conductor.
Thx.

Use #4 in case there is every an upgrade. Copper is cheap now.

 

[donselec]

Use #4 in case there is every an upgrade. Copper is cheap now.

Sounds sensible, but if it's a long distance I'll probably go with 6. I suggested a 200A but they're "on a tight budget," don't you know.
Thx.

 

[hardworkingstiff]

Sounds sensible, but if it's a long distance I'll probably go with 6. I suggested a 200A but they're "on a tight budget," don't you know.
Thx.

What is the cost difference between the 200-amp and 150-amp service? $20?

 

[The Iceman]

I think you need a #4 copper for CEE. NEC 2008, 250.52 A 3, 250.66 B.

 

[wbalsam1]

I think you need a #4 copper for CEE. NEC 2008, 250.52 A 3, 250.66 B.

I agree.:smile:

 

[rexowner]

I think you need a #4 copper for CEE. NEC 2008, 250.52 A 3, 250.66 B.

The OP said he is using rebard for the CEE.
The #6 is for the GEC. The #4 requirement in
250.52 A 3 is if you are using copper wire for the CEE
so is N/A. 250.66 specifies nothing larger than #4
is required for the GEC to the CEE -- if #6 is large enough
for the service (which it is for 150A), #6 is fine for the
GEC, which I believe was the question.

 

[donselec]

I think you need a #4 copper for CEE. NEC 2008, 250.52 A 3, 250.66 B.

250.52 A 3 is 20' of rebar OR 20' of bare copper. Sounds like the bare copper in contact with the concrete? That's what I wasn't sure of. How do you read it.
250.66 B just says it doesn't have to be larger than #4.

 

[wbalsam1]

The OP said he is using rebard for the CEE.
The #6 is for the GEC. The #4 requirement in
250.52 A 3 is if you are using copper wire for the CEE
so is N/A. 250.66 specifies nothing larger than #4
is required for the GEC to the CEE -- if #6 is large enough
for the service (which it is for 150A), #6 is fine for the
GEC, which I believe was the question.

Very good point. Thanks.

 

[donselec]

The OP said he is using rebard for the CEE.
The #6 is for the GEC. The #4 requirement in
250.52 A 3 is if you are using copper wire for the CEE
so is N/A. 250.66 specifies nothing larger than #4
is required for the GEC to the CEE -- if #6 is large enough
for the service (which it is for 150A), #6 is fine for the
GEC, which I believe was the question.

That sounds right, just wanted to be sure.
Thx.

 

[donselec]

What is the cost difference between the 200-amp and 150-amp service? $20?

Well I'm running about 60' cable from the MD to the panel in the garage, plus the riser, etc., so there's a diff.

 

[The Iceman]

I agree. :wink:

 

[infinity]

For 20' or more of 1/2" (#4) or larger rebar the rebar itself is the electrode. The condcutor connecting to it is a GEC. The GEC is sized according to 250.66, so a #6 is permited for a 150 amp service if the service entrance conductors are #1 or #1/0 cu, or #2/0 or #3/0 Al.

 

[hardworkingstiff]

Well I'm running about 60' cable from the MD to the panel in the garage, plus the riser, etc., so there's a diff.

Gotcha! I'm just thinking back to back panel/meterbase, and an underground service lateral provided by PoCo.

There goes that "Assume" again.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Sounds sensible, but if it's a long distance I'll probably go with 6. I suggested a 200A but they're "on a tight budget," don't you know.
Thx.

If this is a new home then why would distance come into play. Just install the wire near where you intend to put the service. 10' is all you need unless you are nuts like I am. I put 20 in the concrete and attach it to the rebar-- why because I can I guess.

 

[donselec]

If this is a new home then why would distance come into play. Just install the wire near where you intend to put the service. 10' is all you need unless you are nuts like I am. I put 20 in the concrete and attach it to the rebar-- why because I can I guess.

Well the home's already built and rebar point of attach. is already in, it may or may not be near where the serv. will go. I agree if it's a short dist. use #4. Another note if the GEC attachment to the CEE is not encased itself, it has to be accessible. Just a footnote. (footing, footnote--no pun intended) :smile:

 

[glene77is]

Don,

About the connection to CEE, in your area:
If Encased, what kind of connector for GEC?
If Not Encased, what kind of connector for GEC?

This is something that seems to be up for interpretation, in our area!

...

 

[donselec]

Don,

About the connection to CEE, in your area:
If Encased, what kind of connector for GEC?
If Not Encased, what kind of connector for GEC?

This is something that seems to be up for interpretation, in our area!

...

Believe it or not I've always used a ground rod clamp and it's passed, but I think they do make a clamp specifically for 1/2" rebar to attach the GEC. The type of clamp shouldn't be dependent on whether it's encased or not, but I suppose you should use the one that's listed for the rebar. Still, like I say, the rod clamp has always passed.

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

passing does not make it legal. We are seeing better inspectors now days. All kind of garbage work passed 20 years ago.