AFCI breaker tripping on lighting ckt after 7 yrs of working fine?

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iwire said:
Confirming once again that many electricians suffer from OCD.:D
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No, many HO suffer from it. Drives em crazy to have all lights off but one switch in a 6 gang plate different from the other 5. Switch orientation is easy compared to getting 6 devices perfectly lined up so the cover plate goes on easily.

We've actually gotten a few service calls for 'lights dont work', only to find that up is off and down is on, opposite of convention.
 
ActionDave said:
Maybe, kind of.

In my own house every three way is different, down up, down down, up down, whatever. On the other hand for jobs I work on, down down is off.
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Seriously I would give my guys a hard time if they where wasting time doing that. :D

If the customer can't tell if the light is on or off they don't deserve to breath.
 
iwire said:
Seriously I would give my guys a hard time if they where wasting time doing that. :D

If the customer can't tell if the light is on or off they don't deserve to breath.
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Oh, they deserve to breathe... and pay as well. Half switched receptacles sometimes get them too.

Had a call a few months ago for an exterior light not working. This home is on the outskirts of our service range. We drive out there only to find the customer doesnt have an exterior light where they think they do, but a motion sensor there that cuts on the other exterior lights (they thought the RAB motion sensor unit actually had a bulb in it). Was on a 3/4/3 way switch that was set to off. One of the easiest billable hours ever.
 
JFletcher said:
No, many HO suffer from it. Drives em crazy to have all lights off but one switch in a 6 gang plate different from the other 5. Switch orientation is easy compared to getting 6 devices perfectly lined up so the cover plate goes on easily.

We've actually gotten a few service calls for 'lights dont work', only to find that up is off and down is on, opposite of convention.
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On single pole switches up should be on and down should be off because they are clearly marked.

On 3-way switches there is no marking and for good reason. Sure you can have the lights off when both switches are down. One switch in the up position and they are on but if you turn the other switch to the up position they are off again. One switch in the down position and they are on again. Add a 4-way and it really gets to be fun.


The only thing I ever keep straight on three and four way switches is ground terminal orientation.
 
I rewired a house, and after about 9 months the cust. said the afci was tripping. Went back and found one of the bulbs in the chandelier was loose.
Same guy calls back in another 6 months, same afci tripping. Isolated it to the bathroom fan, a high end quiet fan. Ended up taking out the afci for a regular cb.
 
I would remove the hot and neutral from the breaker and test for a ground fault with a meter. I would let that tell me how a GFCI breaker would react. That is the most likely culprit.
 
growler said:
On single pole switches up should be on and down should be off because they are clearly marked.

On 3-way switches there is no marking and for good reason. Sure you can have the lights off when both switches are down. One switch in the up position and they are on but if you turn the other switch to the up position they are off again. One switch in the down position and they are on again. Add a 4-way and it really gets to be fun.


The only thing I ever keep straight on three and four way switches is ground terminal orientation.
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the only reason for caring about switch orientation really is 404.7.

That said, we do a fair amount of higher end homes. It's always fun putting in 3 way dimmers vs regular 3 way switches because the dimmers often have the travellers/commons in a different orientation. and believe me, customers we serve are that ... "particular"... about lights being off when all switches are down. I have been asked by both customers and employers to re-do a 6 gang box because one switch is different from the others. These are customers with 5 and 6 gang switches not just at the front door, but in bedrooms and even a few bathrooms. I always energize them and get them the same before I stick the coverplate back on.

"If you are that compulsive you will probably die and early death from stress."

haha. I have a full head of hair and not one grey yet. Some of my customers barely 10 years older than I are solid white or bald. But they are willing to pay me the extra time to do it their way, I dont really care how OCD they are.

(actually, I was trained that when all switches are down, all lights should be off regardless of snap, 3 way, 4 way, etc.).
 
If you have 5 and 6 gang switches you are likely confused as to what all those go to anyway.

I try to only go with 3 gang at any one location but will occasionally use a 4 gang.

In my own home, that I wired, I still find myself occasionally flipping the wrong switch at three and four gang locations after more then 10 years living in there.

I have overhead light as well as recessed wall lights in a stairway, both on three ways at top and bottom of stairs. Only two switches at either end and I can't seem to ever turn on the desired light the first try.
 
In my own house, I like the lights to be off when the switches are all in the down positions, because we have frequent power outages. That way, if I am leaving the house in the dark, I can be sure what is on or off.

Not a lot of fun to go to bed w/ the power out, and then wake up to full lights when it comes back on.
 
kwired said:
I have overhead light as well as recessed wall lights in a stairway, both on three ways at top and bottom of stairs. Only two switches at either end and I can't seem to ever turn on the desired light the first try.
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I had the same problem with my main stairway, until I came up with a mnemonic "pattern" to help me remember.
There is a light at the top of the stairs and at the bottom, on different circuits, so a two gang switch box on the side of the stairway at both top and bottom.
As I move either up or down the stairway, the first switch I come to is the light I am heading toward, the second is the light which is now behind me.
So I just turn on the first switch, then turn off the second.
If I tried instead to remember which switches controlled which light I am sure I would have a harder time of it.

Your pattern will probably be different, but there still should be one which is easy to remember.
 
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