- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
Is AFCI protection required when running on generator power (optional standby) in a dwelling for areas that normally require AFCI protection?
AFCI Protection on Generator Power
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ptonsparky
Tom
- Occupation
- EC - retired
That point makes some of the generator transfer kits rather worthless. Good question.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
I'm not sure I understand a way around it.
If you reenergize a panel that already has an arc fault breaker breaker in it, it's already in place.
if you run directly off of the generator you take the wiring inside the walls out of the equation.
Unless you have outlets in addition to what's already installed in areas that require AFCI, that are fed strictly from the generator and not house power,,,, what is the scenario where this question needs to be asked?
JAP>
ptonsparky
Tom
- Occupation
- EC - retired
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200196674_200196674
This type of transfer switch goes between the Normal supply CBs, and the generator. Switching to the generator would bypass the AFCI.
This type of transfer switch goes between the Normal supply CBs, and the generator. Switching to the generator would bypass the AFCI.
- Location
- Placerville, CA, USA
- Occupation
- Retired PV System Designer
When you use the type of MTS that has individual branch circuit transfers that bypass the panel breakers.
They have individual mini breakers, but no place to put an AFCI.
They have individual mini breakers, but no place to put an AFCI.
ptonsparky
Tom
- Occupation
- EC - retired
Even when installing it on existing wiring the branch circuit extension would be greater than 6'. (If that could be remotely considered.)
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
Yes, that is one scenario I was thinking about. An interlock kit type of install used to energized the entire panel would allow you to use the existing AFCI branch circuit breakers, the separate transfer panels with integral breakers like those in the link would not.
Another scenario is the project I'm currently involved in, ~700 apartments where an option standby system provides power for the refrigerator receptacle and the heat/AC fan cool unit. Currently those circuits are not AFCI protected and I was wondering if there was an exception to that requirement that I was missing.
I would think it would depend more on the location of the outlet, rather than what the outlet was used for.
JAP>
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
He had mentioned a refrigerator and a heat/cool fan unit outlet but not where they were located.
JAP>
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
- Occupation
- EC
In apartment buildings the fridge is likely in the kitchen - if 2014 NEC applies you need to consider if you are creating a new circuit or making more then a 6 foot extension to an existing circuit. The heat/cool fan unit - also likely same thing unless it is not 120 volts 15/20 amps. (think hydronic heat/cooling and 120 volt fan coils, and they are likely in a room requiring AFCI if in an apartment building)
So my answer is no AFCI needed if you don't extend the existing circuit more then 6 feet to install the MTS.
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
The generator is powering a circuit that under normal conditions that would require AFCI protection. When running on optional standby power there is no AFCI protection for the same circuit.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
- Occupation
- EC
Understood, which edition of NEC applies, how much modification is made to the existing branch circuit to accommodate the optional power supply?
If 2014 applies I see this no different then doing a panel change that relocates the panel - if less then 6 feet of conductor needs to be extended to reach the new branch circuit device - no afci needs added to existing circuits. Your feeders between the ATS and the optional system are not a factor, just the branch circuit is what you need to focus on here.
If you have a circuit that is fed from a 1p 20 amp arc fault breaker and you use a transfer panel like the one they showed in the previous post then there is not arc fault protection when the transfer breaker is switched to the generator side is what he's getting at.
JAP>
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
Yup.
So has anyone figured out whether that's acceptable or not throughout this whole thing?
I'd think not.
JAP>
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
- Occupation
- EC
My response assumed he was transferring existing circuits with no AFCI protection - see bold text in above quote, maybe I misunderstood something there?
Otherwise I agree that you can not arrange it to transfer to a non AFCI protected circuit if it was already existing with AFCI.
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