AFCI troubleshoot nightmare

[readydave8]

Am I understanding that hot was hooked to AFCI breaker, neutral directly to neutral bar, and white pigtail from breaker capped? If breaker has ground fault (gfp), it should trip

 

[readydave8]

but the problem is changing before my eyes while working on it

AFCI only trips when there is a load? Can make problem change before your eyes

 

[hbiss]

Am I understanding that hot was hooked to AFCI breaker, neutral directly to neutral bar, and white pigtail from breaker capped? If breaker has ground fault (gfp), it should trip

If this is the case the breaker is tripping on a ground fault, which would be any load connected to it. Probably why you see things changing because the connected loads are going on and off.

-Hal

 

[GoldDigger]

Am I understanding that hot was hooked to AFCI breaker, neutral directly to neutral bar, and white pigtail from breaker capped? If breaker has ground fault (gfp), it should trip

Even with a GF function, the breaker can do nothing but thermal and mag trip if the electronics is not getting any power. And the power comes from line to neutral pigtail voltage, even in the case of most two pole 240V breakers.

 

[hbiss]

And the power comes from line to neutral pigtail voltage...

Ah, yeah. This whole thing has gotten so convoluted I can't even think straight.

What I would do is replace the breaker with new and remove every device on the circuit leaving the tails hanging. Reconnect one branch at a time to the HR, then starting with the nearest device on that branch, re-install it. Somewhere in that procedure the breaker will trip and you will know where to look. Or it might not trip, indicating that there was a ground to neutral short that was corrected when you re-installed the devices.

You have to be logical when you troubleshoot. You can't be all over the place assuming things. If something doesn't seem right, find the reason for it.

-Hal

 

[joebeadg]

afci

afci

hbiss, I would have gone along those lines, I think. was troubleshooting logically, as I saw fit. Was scheduled to go back today, but got a VM from them yesterday saying they couldn't wait, got someone else to repair it, Who knows what they did? I don't. Thank you all for youre input, really appreciate it

 

[kwired]

Am I understanding that hot was hooked to AFCI breaker, neutral directly to neutral bar, and white pigtail from breaker capped? If breaker has ground fault (gfp), it should trip

GD stole what I was going to reply with:

Even with a GF function, the breaker can do nothing but thermal and mag trip if the electronics is not getting any power. And the power comes from line to neutral pigtail voltage, even in the case of most two pole 240V breakers.

someone turned that $40-50 AFCI breaker into a $4-8 "standard" breaker by not connecting the neutral lead.

 

[Little Bill]

GD stole what I was going to reply with:



someone turned that $40-50 AFCI breaker into a $4-8 "standard" breaker by not connecting the neutral lead.

And the world would be safer if the lead was connected!:roll:

 

[hbiss]

And that's probably what the "someone else" did and told the customer it works fine now. That'll be $150.

-Hal

 

[readydave8]

Even with a GF function, the breaker can do nothing but thermal and mag trip if the electronics is not getting any power. And the power comes from line to neutral pigtail voltage, even in the case of most two pole 240V breakers.

I never thought of that! Now I know how to fix nuiscance tripping AFCI breaker without changing it out to standard breaker. I wonder if I ever will:? Hope not.

 

[GoldDigger]

I never thought of that! Now I know how to fix nuiscance tripping AFCI breaker without changing it out to standard breaker. I wonder if I ever will:? Hope not.

That is probably one reason for manufacturers to put in a self test function that will not allow the breaker to reset without power being applied!

 

[JFletcher]

And that's probably what the "someone else" did and told the customer it works fine now. That'll be $150.

-Hal

For his sake I hope not, or that Eagle Eye home inspector will catch that tucked in pigtail.

Besides, everyone in the know knows that you're supposed to cut the pig tail off and pretend it's a plug in neutral.:angel::lol:

( for the satire impaired, the above comment is not how you fix a miswired AFCI breaker)

 

[kwired]

Inspector doesn't need to be eagle eyed, pressing the test button and failing to trip should raise more questions.