Another example of poor pricing....

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c2500

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I am wiring a custom home right now. 4100+/- square feet. 400 amp service with 2-200 subpanels.

The builder who did the framing used a canned software package to quote finishing the job, including the electrical. Electrical was Labor $4800. Fixtures $5000.

I chuckled. I am a licensed residential builder as well as licensed residential electrican. I was amazed that he would throw such a low number out. It reminded me of the low numbers the NAHB has on their web site for the average 3200 square foot house. (While I wont discuss the figures for the job, the real number for the electrical is substantially higher with a base material cost of around $4k so far early into the job) No provision for upgrades...just a blind uneducated guess from some software that I am sure assumes a single 200amp panel.

Other numbers shown....

Hardwood floors $18,000. That works out to 3500ft of flooring installed and finished for $5.14. Once again CHEAP. Flooring alone will run $2.00 a foot for a number one oak. Maybe it assumes $1.00 per foot imigrant labor installed with elcheapo finishing.

Kitchen cabinets $25,000

Appliances $7800. Install Labor $500.

In this economy, I would be afraid to throw numbers around like this. I guess he most hope to churn some money to keep that payment on those newer diesel trucks they drive. Forget about making a profit.

This is a $750,000+ house.

Plus it irks me that electrical is so undervalued.

c2500
 
That is why pursuing new residential (non-custom) work, unless you are completely "dialed in" and set up to do it fast, is a fools exercise.
 
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Just talking to a builder north of me, he said the 3800 sq custom home they are building has reached $92K for electrical so far and there are plenty of extras he still needs priced.
 
For 4100 square feet, the "lets get started" price is right around 20K (not including fixtures), and it goes up from there with changes. Not sure what you can wire for 4800 bucks. A townhouse, I guess.
 
Just think of the HOs who get a copy of that software and want to know why you are ripping them off...
 
i had a guy meet me once w/ some plans that were draw by the interior decorator, not to scale. the program wasn't a drafting program but just some type of room layout program they used at the furniture store the decorator works at. it needed a new service, replace some light fixtures, and a couple of receps added. before doing any serious estimating i told the guy it would probably start around $5k. i should've taken a picture of the look on his face. it started as a look of shock, then turned to hideous disgust. oh well.
 
brantmacga said:
before doing any serious estimating i told the guy it would probably start around $5k. i should've taken a picture of the look on his face. it started as a look of shock, then turned to hideous disgust. oh well.
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I sometimes shoot off highball prices just to gauge the sincerity of the buyer. I did this about 3 years ago to a guy for a service upgrade on a 14 unit building. He did look shocked, but said he'd have to budget and save a bit for that, and he'd call back. Yeah, right. We've all heard that; buyers are liars. To my surprise, I get an email from him about a month ago that said he's got the funds prepared and wants a more accurate estimate now. First time for everything. Now, I just gotta try and remember what I blurted out 3 years ago and make it a tad higher.
 
ITO said:
Just think of the HOs who get a copy of that software and want to know why you are ripping them off...
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i always hear homeowners telling me "while i know what (insert items) costs so it shouldnt be that much"

one of my favorites is "ill supply the parts" people pay top dollar for plumbers to install nice toilets and faucets but when it comes to electricians they think it should be free. main reason why i hate residential
 
I said it before, I'll say it again. Society's values have changed. It's not about life anymore, it's all about stuff. Cool, new and trendy stuff. Labor and skill have little value.

They'll pay $3500.- for the Maytag Duet with steam. As long as it's free delivery.
 
Along the same line...

My HVAC guy called me today to tell me he had spoken with a competitor of his. The guy was complaining about making $250 per system after paying for everything. His comment was the builder won't pay the higher price. Of course my response is find another builder to work for. Another example of price bullying.

The job I am working on right now is wiring a house for a friend/neighbor/doctor. One of the plumbers made a comment he had alot of time off. My friend said he works 3-12 hours shifts a week, so his time can be flexible...but sometimes it is 4 or 5 days in a row.

The plumber said you make $400K a year doing that and I make $500. I about lost it...one I don't think my friend is doing that well...but if he is more power to him (and I won't go into the education required, etc etc). Two, if the plumber was not giving his work away, $325 a fixture..(normally should be $425 to $475 or so around here)..he might have more than $500 a week in his pocket. He had made multiple comments about all the work to do with no money coming in....well DUH!

c2500
 
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