any reason why not to use stinger leg?

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220/221 said:
So...if the unit said 200 volts would it matter if they were grounded or ungrounded conductors?

Not codewise but would it function?
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Volts are volts, without regard to whether one conductor is referenced to ground or not.
 
Da Stinger

Da Stinger

I'm with Augie...
augie47 said:
it's a violation of 408.3 (E). As I recall, eons ago "C" was the high leg. Perhaps the Murray panel is old, but I'm suprised to see it as a requirement on any recently produced panel.
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208 V is "B" Phase around town here. I hope everyone would know their colors and have a complete understanding of regional or in-house color codes before dealing with a Stinger.

Just a rare moment today:
Boss was studying voltage dispaly from digital montior on main gear, studing voltage, stating voltage, here look, then Buzz, his cell vibrates, his arm drops and starts laughing ... ... "You would not believe, LOL, fill'n the gear room" ...
 
On the Murry Panel, I put in in 3 years ago. It is relatively new and still available. The POCO wired the service to the main disconnect designating C as high leg. All of the documentation on the panel also discusses C being high. The inspector had no issue. I thought nothing of it. FYI, the POCO is SRP in Phoenix.

This AC Compressor range is 208 to beyond 240. So for the reasons stated earlier, I am not using C to N. My question of using the C to A or B for 240V is more of a question of issue with the AC unit and if maybe there was issue with an insulation or dielectric spec saying a max of 120 to ground was required. I can't find anything so opinions are good. The instability discussion is also valuable information. --Tom
 
postgenerate said:
The inspector had no issue. I thought nothing of it. FYI, the POCO is SRP in Phoenix.

--Tom
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Both APS and SRP reuire it on C phase. Something to do with their meters I believe.


The Phx inspector just missed it.
 
Luketrician said:
Hey I have a question. What makes the stinger leg unstable? Is it deemed unstable because the voltage fluctuates? If so, is that due to other loads cycling on and off on the other two ungrounded phases?

:confused:
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Well, I guess I had bit on the old urban legend. I just have always heard that the wild leg was "unstable", so, I repeated it! :D
 
We always connect as much equipment as possible to the high leg on delta connected services. This spreads the loads out more evenly as desired by the OP.

Yes, you can use the high leg on 240 Volt equipment. Just ensure that there are no neutral connections required(for things like dryers and ranges) and it won't know the difference.
 
kbsparky said:
We always connect as much equipment as possible to the high leg on delta connected services. This spreads the loads out more evenly as desired by the OP.

Yes, you can use the high leg on 240 Volt equipment. Just ensure that there are no neutral connections required(for things like dryers and ranges) and it won't know the difference.
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I avoid using it because I am always concerned about some clown appliance repairman getting in there and causing problems because he doesn't understand.
 
You cannot use 120/240V circuit breakers on the high leg it must be 240V rated,240V rated 2 pole breakers are from what I understand rather pricey.
 
Luketrician said:
Hey I have a question. What makes the stinger leg unstable? Is it deemed unstable because the voltage fluctuates?
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mdshunk said:
I think that this is a myth. I have recorded many of these services for other purposes, and have not identified any marked instability in the high leg.
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minuteman said:
Well, I guess I had bit on the old urban legend. I just have always heard that the wild leg was "unstable", so, I repeated it!
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Charlie Eldridge has said that there is a voltage fluctuation problem with using the high leg for 208V loads, here.

I have not witnessed it myself, so I don't know. I'd avoid it just due to the unknown, and the difficulties placed on us by the code, getting the right breaker for the job.
 
kbsparky and charlie,

This is great advice, thanks, and it exactly matches my purpose of spreading the load. What is the point of all that extra fuse and transformer capacity if you can't use it! As far as the clowns, everybody has clown moments. I will mark as much orange paint and permanent signage indicating connection as I possibly can. -- Tom

Side note: I have 13 more AC units to purchase over the next 9 years. (i.e. my semi-retirement plans are in place). After dealing with customer support, I realize that I have purchased my last "Janitrol/Goodman" unit.
 
In a lot of the old 240 Delta services here, the wild leg has a smaller conductor than the other two. I recall recently on a 200-amp service, A & C were 3/0 and B was #2. After the meter, all three were 3/0.
 
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georgestolz said:
Charlie Eldridge has said that there is a voltage fluctuation problem with using the high leg for 208V loads, here..
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What he describes is what can happen if you load the wild leg. The measurements I have taken were with no phase to neutral loads on the wild leg. He talks about a situation described as "collapsing the delta", which puzzles me a little. I wonder if anyone has a technical explanation of what that might be?
 
mdshunk said:
What he describes is what can happen if you load the wild leg. The measurements I have taken were with no phase to neutral loads on the wild leg. He talks about a situation described as "collapsing the delta", which puzzles me a little. I wonder if anyone has a technical explanation of what that might be?[/QUOTE]


that would an interesting read :smile:
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