Aprenticeship or Not

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Alwayslearningelec

Senior Member
Location
NJ
Occupation
Estimator
Ok you guys probably know where I am at as far as knowledge by some of the questions I have asked and I do feel I have a lot to learn as I have never installed so much as an outlet. I am considering going into the field to start as an apprentice. They are calling the next class(Union.. I am already in the union just a differnet one) in June and I can get in there but I am concerned that it will be a pretty hefty pay cut for the first few years and I am pretty old already( 32) for this as most apprentices I would imagine are in thier early 20's. I don't have any kids and not too much overhead. Don't know what to do.

Thanks for any input.
 
celtic

celtic

Senior Member
Location
NJ
horsegoer said:
(. I am already in the union just a differnet one)
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What trade is it that you are invovled with now?

horsegoer said:
I am concerned that it will be a pretty hefty pay cut for the first few years and I am pretty old already( 32) for this as most apprentices I would imagine are in thier early 20's. I don't have any kids and not too much overhead. Don't know what to do.
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In the long run, where is the greater earning potential - where you are at now or where you may go?
 
A

Alwayslearningelec

Senior Member
Location
NJ
Occupation
Estimator
In the long run I think after I become a journeyman put together with what I have learned in the office for a few years I think that migh be a good combo.

Maybe if some people who either own a business/work in the office as a estimator, project mnager etc can chime in as to whether or not they think their field experience has helped them( granted they worked in the field).

Thanks very much.
 
D

DAWGS

Senior Member
Location
Virginia
Yes, field experience is a huge factor for estimating, and a P.M. job. If thats what you are shootin for definatley go into the apprenticeship and work as a JW a few years first.
 
celtic

celtic

Senior Member
Location
NJ
horsegoer said:
Maybe if some people who either own a business/work in the office as a estimator, project mnager etc can chime in as to whether or not they think their field experience has helped them( granted they worked in the field).
Click to expand...

I say YES.
 
resistance

resistance

Senior Member
Location
WA
celtic said:
What trade is it that you are invovled with now?


In the long run, where is the greater earning potential - where you are at now or where you may go?
Click to expand...

The above are good questions!

Let me say this. Many are over the age of 32 and still going strong in the electrical trade. But, many started out at a younger age. With that said, I?m sure many may agree, that with time comes experience (depending on how you apply yourself :rolleyes:) , and having this experience makes your job a lot easier! In a nut shell, and based on my experience with old, and new residential construction. I wouldn't think of starting in the residential electrical trade at 32. <--------Yet, don't let what I say discourage you! This is just my own personal feelings.
 
Greg Swartz

Greg Swartz

Senior Member
Location
Colorado Springs, Colorado
If you are ultimately looking for an office position, then you will need to finish your 5 year apprenticeship, and a couple years at least as a Journeyman.

I think that being a PM, General Foreman, Estimator, Superintendent are good and honorable positions... especially if you worked from an apprentice.

I just became an Electrical Engineer. It was a tough road, and I'm 36.
From Apprentice, to Journeyman, to Master, to EC, to EE... There are times that it sucked.

I agree with the guys: I wouldn't take an apprentice residential position, and can you live with the pay cut?

Also, are you going to be the best apprentice out there? My point is that there will probably be lay-offs involved, and as an apprentice, you need seniority, but you need to be better than your peers. Your bosses will find a way to keep you.
 
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J

JES2727

Senior Member
Location
NJ
I have known some apprentices who were your age and older when they got started in the JATC program. Not alot, but at least a few. If you can live with the reduction in your pay for the first couple of years, I believe it is a wothwhile endeavor regardless of your age.
 
resistance

resistance

Senior Member
Location
WA
JES2727 said:
I have known some apprentices who were your age and older when they got started in the JATC program. Not alot, but at least a few. If you can live with the reduction in your pay for the first couple of years, I believe it is a wothwhile endeavor regardless of your age.
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-Depending on the kind of electrical work you are doing---Age is a huge factor!!
-Also, depending on where you live and the company you work with, the pay is not all that great for residential electricians!
-I knew some older guys breaking into the trade, but most are doing it as a hobby [:wink:], or to supplement their retirement. Trust me, they are not doing the hard work, and most were the first to go during layoffs :(
 
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A

Alwayslearningelec

Senior Member
Location
NJ
Occupation
Estimator
I would start at around $17 an hour and to off at around $43 for a journeyman. My goal would be to get back into the office after becoming a journeyman with already having about 4 years experience as an estimator. I can handle the pay cut.
 
L

Legrand

Member
Location
New Mexico
I stopped traveling as an industrial apprentice to settle down with the fam, I'm now a residential apprentice. It's a pay CUT. I'm BROKE. One year to go though. YEAH!!
 
jmsbrush

jmsbrush

Senior Member
Location
Central Florida
Hey horse Ive told ya before too lol. Nothing beats experience! I also have stated in my opinion, you can't become a good estimator until you have been in the field. Theres allot more to it , than just taking off rec and switches, when we are talking about commercial and industrial work.
I was 21 when I started my App. There were guys in there at the age of 42 and 48. I did my 5 years and topped out. I think it is one of the best things I have done for myself. Nobody can take that away when you finish. I'm an EC now and still hold my ticket. You just never know when you might need it.

With all that being said, Everyday I get to find out how much I really don't know.;) With all the experience that I have mustard up, Its just the Icing on the cake. I still find myself asking questions when I'm doing certain take offs.
Many of those times I have to go back from the Experience I have collected and make a decision.

The whole thing is a domino effect. A estimator can make or break a company,Same with a Good or bad Foreman to the crew that he is running.
If you have a good crew in place and if the estimator makes a big mistake on a bid it does not matter how good the crew is the company will loose money.
 
quogueelectric

quogueelectric

Senior Member
Location
new york
horsegoer said:
I would start at around $17 an hour and to off at around $43 for a journeyman. My goal would be to get back into the office after becoming a journeyman with already having about 4 years experience as an estimator. I can handle the pay cut.
Click to expand...
Sure you could just tell Chris Kelly that you want to demand more money for estimating experience.
 
Fulthrotl

Fulthrotl

~Autocorrect is My Worst Enema.~
Location
HB, CA (19 Hrs. 22 Min. from Winged Horses)
Occupation
E
horsegoer said:
Ok you guys probably know where I am at as far as knowledge by some of the questions I have asked and I do feel I have a lot to learn as I have never installed so much as an outlet. I am considering going into the field to start as an apprentice. They are calling the next class(Union.. I am already in the union just a differnet one) in June and I can get in there but I am concerned that it will be a pretty hefty pay cut for the first few years and I am pretty old already( 32) for this as most apprentices I would imagine are in thier early 20's. I don't have any kids and not too much overhead. Don't know what to do.

Thanks for any input.
Click to expand...

depends on where you serve your apprenticeship. here's three examples:

san francisco, ca.
highest union scale in america.
last time i looked, anyway, and there were 7 hour workdays,
and double time for everything over 7 hours.
i remember seeing my working partners check stubs from the job
he just got off of before we were working together.
3 paycheck stubs in a row that were above $5,000 a week

houston, tx.
lot's of work after the flooding, the BA says.
scale is $24 an hour. oh, boy.

LADWP, los angeles, ca.
scale's good, but the pension's the thing.
3 year apprenticeship.
an old working partner is there now.
keeps calling me up, telling me to get in.
$40 an hour on the check, he's grossing 110k a year.
pension can amount to 90% of highest classification
every held, with cost of living increases, and lifetime
medical. double dipping is allowed, and encouraged.

i've worked with high school graduates who are lifers
at LADWP, retired with a pension, working as exempt
workers, who between the pension and their exempt
wages, make over $200,000 a year. it happens.

YMMV.

randy
 
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