Arc Fault Breakers for Smoke Detectors

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hhsting said:
Actually smoke detector and carbon monoxide detector all in one is hard wired. No outlet.
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As packersparky stated it still is an outlet by Article 100 definition. It does not have to be a receptacle to be an outlet.

Outlet. A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment.
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LarryFine said:
We've even debated whether a switch box is considered to be an outlet.
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The box is not the outlet. The outlet may be within the box. If all that is in the box is a simple switch, there is no outlet, that switch does not fit the NEC definition of outlet.

If it is a complex switch, say a programmable switch or something, then the logic portion of the control will have an "outlet", IMO.
 
I have combo smoke detrctor and carbon monoxide detector hard wired. Not sure hiw they do it but I would imagine their is no switch at the detector dewelling unit.

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hhsting said:
I have combo smoke detrctor and carbon monoxide detector hard wired. Not sure hiw they do it but I would imagine their is no switch at the detector dewelling unit.
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Forget about the switch discussion it has nothing to do with your question about smoke alarms and AFCI protection. :)
 
hhsting said:
I have combo smoke detrctor and carbon monoxide detector hard wired. Not sure hiw they do it but I would imagine their is no switch at the detector dewelling unit.

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The unit in question is utilization equipment - it is a load to the electrical system - it has an "outlet". Exact location of that "outlet" is a little debatable, but there is one. More recent code editions added "devices" into 210.12, but it always applied to "outlets".
 
kwired said:
The box is not the outlet. The outlet may be within the box. If all that is in the box is a simple switch, there is no outlet, that switch does not fit the NEC definition of outlet.
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NEC said:
Outlet. A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment.
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Whether a receptacle or a light is installed, or a load is hard-wired, it seems to describe what is inside of the box to me.

If it is a complex switch, say a programmable switch or something, then the logic portion of the control will have an "outlet", IMO.
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If the electronics in the device is the utilization equipment, it can't also be its own outlet; it is powered from the outlet.
 
kwired said:
Not only the rooms mentioned, but the entire branch circuit must be protected. So if you install interconnected units all on one circu0

What if there is no gas burning appliances to create any CO?
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A fireplace can generate CO2 also, as can a smouldering upholstery or carpet fire


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GoldDigger said:
A fireplace can generate CO2 also, as can a smouldering upholstery or carpet fire


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Those events will trigger a standard smoke.
In Illinois, CO alarms are only required if the home is supplied with nat gas or has an attached garage.
 
hhsting said:
I have combo smoke detector and carbon monoxide detector hard wired. Not sure how they do it but I would imagine their is no switch at the detector dewelling unit.

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I am just struggling with this might as well tell the story. Their was a job that I was doing brand new apartment complex almost height of high rise dewelling units brand new smoke detectors and inspector did not say anything and it was not on AFCI. Inspector said you never put smoke detector on AFCI. I looked all over for reason and IRC allows some household to have smoke detector fire alarm system but I am not sure if this job was one of them. I am not trying to troll but given the information on this and other threads it just looks odd and wanted your straight forward opinon thats all being that many dewelling units smoke detectors in height almost high rise. I noted the model number Universal Security part MIC1509S spec attached in Post #34 attachment. Is the inspector correct that it does not need AFCI? Thanks.

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hhsting said:
I am just struggling with this might as well tell the story. Their was a job that I was doing brand new apartment complex almost height of high rise dewelling units brand new smoke detectors and inspector did not say anything and it was not on AFCI. Inspector said you never put smoke detector on AFCI. I looked all over for reason and IRC allows some household to have smoke detector fire alarm system but I am not sure if this job was one of them. I am not trying to troll but given the information on this and other threads it just looks odd and wanted your straight forward opinon thats all being that many dewelling units smoke detectors in height almost high rise. I noted the model number Universal Security part MIC1509S spec attached in Post #34 attachment. Is the inspector correct that it does not need AFCI? Thanks.
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Same answer as elsewhere in this thread, no.
 
hhsting said:
I am just struggling with this might as well tell the story. Their was a job that I was doing brand new apartment complex almost height of high rise dewelling units brand new smoke detectors and inspector did not say anything and it was not on AFCI. Inspector said you never put smoke detector on AFCI. I looked all over for reason and IRC allows some household to have smoke detector fire alarm system but I am not sure if this job was one of them. I am not trying to troll but given the information on this and other threads it just looks odd and wanted your straight forward opinon thats all being that many dewelling units smoke detectors in height almost high rise. I noted the model number Universal Security part MIC1509S spec attached in Post #34 attachment. Is the inspector correct that it does not need AFCI? Thanks.

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The inspector is correct. NO AFCI NEEDED.
 
romex jockey said:
Iirc, that is the reason battery BU smokes became mandatory via nfpa

The irony being some states (such as mine) recently allowed for Lith-Ion (battery only) smoke installs


~RJ~
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IIRC AFCI is a relatively new product vs smokes and smokes have had battery backup for a long time before that.

Existing homes and apartments were allowed to have battery only smokes if they were existing prior to a certain level of remodel. IDR that level. We almost always installed new.

The Lith-Ion and wireless that can work with the existing smokes are a plus.
 
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