are crimps acceptable for joining wires

[rszimm]

Are these crimp type connectors legal alternatives to wire nuts for solid wire?
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Gardner-...lice-Wire-Connectors-75-Pack-75-123/202522630

If so, what's the best crimp tool for working with these? My Ideal pliers (which look like this) have a crimping area, but I always considered that only for the un-insulated copper crimps you put on ground wires.

I've got to raise a 40 circuit main panel and I'm going to be doing a lot of extensions. 120 wire nuts are going to take up a huge amount of space so I'd prefer something simpler and more compact.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Those are fine however make sure they are suitable for solid wire. Years ago they used to state stranded wire only but the specs I red online do not have those restrictions.

 

[JFletcher]

Are these crimp type connectors legal alternatives to wire nuts for solid wire?
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Gardner-...lice-Wire-Connectors-75-Pack-75-123/202522630

If so, what's the best crimp tool for working with these? My Ideal pliers (which look like this) have a crimping area, but I always considered that only for the un-insulated copper crimps you put on ground wires.

I've got to raise a 40 circuit main panel and I'm going to be doing a lot of extensions. 120 wire nuts are going to take up a huge amount of space so I'd prefer something simpler and more compact.

Welcome. and you've piqued my curiosity: why and how far do you have to raise the panel? By moving circuits around, you could probably avoid wirenuts on half or so of the ungrounded conductors.

You need to look to see if the buttsplice connector mfg has a list of approved crimp tools. Using something outside of that or non-approved would be a 110.3(B) violation.

I'd rather use wagos or wirenuts than buttsplices, but to each his own.

 

[user 100]

Are these crimp type connectors legal alternatives to wire nuts for solid wire?
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Gardner-...lice-Wire-Connectors-75-Pack-75-123/202522630

If so, what's the best crimp tool for working with these? My Ideal pliers (which look like this) have a crimping area, but I always considered that only for the un-insulated copper crimps you put on ground wires.

I've got to raise a 40 circuit main panel and I'm going to be doing a lot of extensions. 120 wire nuts are going to take up a huge amount of space so I'd prefer something simpler and more compact.

As said above make sure they are approved for solid before using and that you follow installation instructions - 110.14(B) and 110.3(B)

Personally I would steer clear of those but if you are going to use them no matter what, at least pretwist your inline splice....

Three other better options imo are the Ideal splice line connectors (fastest)`, the buchanan crimp done with the 4 way tool, capped w/ snap on cover or heat shrinked/taped (very good but costly) or the Garder Bender copper crimp sleeves insulated w/ heat shrink (very stealthy and cheapest, but slowest).

 

[peter d]

.......Didn't read before posting. :slaphead:

 

[kwired]

Looked in GB's on line catalog - even found the same product # - couldn't find any information regarding solid or stranded conductors.

 

[rszimm]

Welcome. and you've piqued my curiosity: why and how far do you have to raise the panel? By moving circuits around, you could probably avoid wirenuts on half or so of the ungrounded conductors.

I've got to move it up a foot. It's currently within 3' of the gas vent and the meter has to be 3'6" above the ground (it's currently just under that), so up it goes. I'm hoping that most of the connections come from above and I'll actually get more slack when I fish them out of the wall, but Murphy's Law states that they'll all come from below. I'm sure that a few circuits I can make work by rearranging or moving the breakers to the bottom of the panel, but I always hate it when the blanks aren't at the bottom.

 

[Besoeker]

Are these crimp type connectors legal alternatives to wire nuts for solid wire?
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Gardner-...lice-Wire-Connectors-75-Pack-75-123/202522630

If so, what's the best crimp tool for working with these? My Ideal pliers (which look like this) have a crimping area, but I always considered that only for the un-insulated copper crimps you put on ground wires.

I've got to raise a 40 circuit main panel and I'm going to be doing a lot of extensions. 120 wire nuts are going to take up a huge amount of space so I'd prefer something simpler and more compact.

Hello!
I'd prefer them to wire nuts.
But in my area of activity (industrial) neither would be permitted.
It's to do with visibility of all joints and terminations.
And I can understand that.

 

[infinity]

Are these crimp type connectors legal alternatives to wire nuts for solid wire?
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Gardner-...lice-Wire-Connectors-75-Pack-75-123/202522630

If so, what's the best crimp tool for working with these? My Ideal pliers (which look like this) have a crimping area, but I always considered that only for the un-insulated copper crimps you put on ground wires.

I've got to raise a 40 circuit main panel and I'm going to be doing a lot of extensions. 120 wire nuts are going to take up a huge amount of space so I'd prefer something simpler and more compact.

Just get the crimp tool that's listed for use with that product.

 

[K8MHZ]

Are these crimp type connectors legal alternatives to wire nuts for solid wire?
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Gardner-...lice-Wire-Connectors-75-Pack-75-123/202522630

If so, what's the best crimp tool for working with these? My Ideal pliers (which look like this) have a crimping area, but I always considered that only for the un-insulated copper crimps you put on ground wires.

I've got to raise a 40 circuit main panel and I'm going to be doing a lot of extensions. 120 wire nuts are going to take up a huge amount of space so I'd prefer something simpler and more compact.

I would never use those for 120 volt applications. Especially for solid wire. Those butt splices are for 12 volt applications, and even on those they are iffy at best.

These are at least designed for the application. Ideal SpliceLine.

 

[iwire]

I would never use those for 120 volt applications. Especially for solid wire. Those butt splices are for 12 volt applications,

I am going to say you are mistaken and they can be used up to 600 volts.

 

[K8MHZ]

I am going to say you are mistaken and they can be used up to 600 volts.

I tried to find some nomenclature on the OP's 'Gardner Bender' connector and those aren't even listed on GB's web site.

http://www.gardnerbender.com/en/products/connections

You really would use the product the OP pictured for 600 volts? Sure, the nomenclature may state that to be acceptable, but in real world applications, would you really use those?

What would you think if you opened up a 120/240 panel that had dozens of cheap barrel type crimp connectors on solid wire? I, personally, would carefully put the cover back on and walk away.

Did you manage to find something from the manufacturer that states the connectors in question have a 600 volt rating?

 

[qcroanoke]

I tried to find some nomenclature on the OP's 'Gardner Bender' connector and those aren't even listed on GB's web site.

http://www.gardnerbender.com/en/products/connections

You really would use the product the OP pictured for 600 volts? Sure, the nomenclature may state that to be acceptable, but in real world applications, would you really use those?

What would you think if you opened up a 120/240 panel that had dozens of cheap barrel type crimp connectors on solid wire? I, personally, would carefully put the cover back on and walk away.

Did you manage to find something from the manufacturer that states the connectors in question have a 600 volt rating?

This link is from their wesite: http://www.gardnerbender.com/en/75-123

 

[kwired]

I tried to find some nomenclature on the OP's 'Gardner Bender' connector and those aren't even listed on GB's web site.

http://www.gardnerbender.com/en/products/connections

You really would use the product the OP pictured for 600 volts? Sure, the nomenclature may state that to be acceptable, but in real world applications, would you really use those?

What would you think if you opened up a 120/240 panel that had dozens of cheap barrel type crimp connectors on solid wire? I, personally, would carefully put the cover back on and walk away.

Did you manage to find something from the manufacturer that states the connectors in question have a 600 volt rating?

FWIW here is the online catalog I found, I think the link will take you to the page the model number of the splice in question appears on.

It does say they are rated for 600 volts, does indicate they are UL listed, does indicate size of conductor they are designed for, does not mention solid or stranded at all.

 

[iwire]

You really would use the product the OP pictured for 600 volts? Sure, the nomenclature may state that to be acceptable, but in real world applications, would you really use those?

Not for 600VAC but I have and will again with 480 volt circuits.

Why not?

What would you think if you opened up a 120/240 panel that had dozens of cheap barrel type crimp connectors on solid wire?

I would not even notice it and continue with what I was up to.

I, personally, would carefully put the cover back on and walk away.

I think you are nuts.

You must not do any work at all in industrial settings, they love crimps and use them at all voltage levels.

Did you manage to find something from the manufacturer that states the connectors in question have a 600 volt rating?

qcroanoke already did and I have a package of Burndy 509401 22-16 AWG butt splices rated 600 volts here on my desk.

 

[K8MHZ]

FWIW here is the online catalog I found, I think the link will take you to the page the model number of the splice in question appears on.

It does say they are rated for 600 volts, does indicate they are UL listed, does indicate size of conductor they are designed for, does not mention solid or stranded at all.

Thanks, for some reason that info is not on their site.

 

[kwired]

This link is from their wesite: http://www.gardnerbender.com/en/75-123

Link to catalog I linked to is at the bottom of that page. I think that is how I got to the catalog first time. Neither page tells whether the devices are rated for solid or stranded conductor. I have to assume either at this point.

 

[kwired]

I tried to find some nomenclature on the OP's 'Gardner Bender' connector and those aren't even listed on GB's web site.

http://www.gardnerbender.com/en/products/connections

You really would use the product the OP pictured for 600 volts? Sure, the nomenclature may state that to be acceptable, but in real world applications, would you really use those?

What would you think if you opened up a 120/240 panel that had dozens of cheap barrel type crimp connectors on solid wire? I, personally, would carefully put the cover back on and walk away.

Did you manage to find something from the manufacturer that states the connectors in question have a 600 volt rating?

You are welcome to dislike them, as you are with any product.

If you were an inspector what would be your justification to reject them other then you don't like them?

 

[K8MHZ]

Why not? I would not even notice it and continue with what I was up to.

And I would pass such a job on to you, and you could 'own' the mess when the splices fail just after you have had your mitts in it. One or two, no issue. But the OP was talking dozens.

I think you are nuts.

At least we understand each other.

You must not do any work at all in industrial settings, they love crimps and use them at all voltage levels.

I spent too many years in maintenance for a company that had die cast foundries, machine shops and packaging lines. Yes, I know they love butt splice crimps and I have fixed many, that's why I don't like them.

Bob, do you really use such connectors on solid wire?

qcroanoke already did and I have a package of Burndy 509401 22-16 AWG butt splices rated 600 volts here on my desk.

I was going to suggest a different brand if the GB's weren't really listed. 3M makes very good connectors, I have used hundreds. I'll bet the GB ones are cheesy compared to 3M and Burndy.

 

[K8MHZ]

You are welcome to dislike them, as you are with any product.

If you were an inspector what would be your justification to reject them other then you don't like them?

I am not an inspector, I am a skilled tradesman. Inspectors have to allow the worst possible work allowed by law.